From $0 to Billionaire By Starting A Toy Factory In China - Billy Of The Week

so age eighteen him and his brother get on a plane they go to hong kong and they're like we are going to start our toy factory here in hong kong they get there first night he literally sleeps in a bush because they didn't have like you know a place to stay that night so he sleeps on bush why when he just do a sidewalk too hard bro he you know you don't wanna sleep on the ground you know when sleep on on a bush so he sleeps on a bush outside of the normal he's a bench alright we lied i got something good for you i got a crazy story in fact this is a billy of the week million dollars isn't cool you know it's cool a billion dollars you know sometimes we get a little fast and to the billy of the week where it's not a real billy this guy is a real billionaire okay so have you ever heard the name nick mow no okay so nick mow here's the here's my headline for this university drop out from new zealand becomes a billionaire with zero dollars invested okay so what what happened i'll i i'll click yeah you clicked alright here's here's the next bit two brothers when they were in i think middle school they enter a science fair and in the science fair they create a hot air balloon modeling kit and they end up winning the science fair so here's nick twelve years old wins the science fair he decides alright people really likes my hot air balloon kit that my like model powder balloon kit i'm gonna go selfie so he goes to start selling them door to door and he opens up a farm a little like factory in his his family's farm to like build the kits as he's going but like he's having trouble scaling up because he's trying to do production himself and and he's doing the sales himself and it's like okay this is tough so age eighteen him and his brother get on a plane they go to hong kong and they're like we are going to start our toy factory here in hong kong they get there first night he literally sleeps on a bush because they didn't have like you know a place to stay that night so he sleeps on bush when he just do a sidewalk too hard bro he he you know he don't wanna sleep on the ground you know when i sleep on on a bush so he sleeps on a bush outside of the normal use the bench they end up getting a apartment that i think was eight dollars a month and that was their their apartment what they start a factory this was now maybe fifteen years ago ish something like that and so and they're in a very small city in china and so not they're not in hong kong anymore so they they end up creating a a a factory and so here's the factory so they they create a factory nick ends up sleeping in the factory for eight years and they had thirteen thousand dollars to their name that was what their parents loaned them to start this business and so they're like they're like how do we make this work and so they they want to create this like kind of toy company and so they're like alright and so they do they start doing two things number one they're like alright we only have this much money and now we're living in china we gotta like make this stretch so these guys are like doing all the like you know the hustle porn stories you hear for entrepreneurship they're doing it where he's like we used to eat only off the dollar menu at mcdonald's in china and he's like every day he's like for christmas we would go get the big mac and it was like two dollars in change and that was our celebration he's like i would eat half my fries and then i would go back to the counter but like hey this is like not even full when i get a full container of fries he's like that's how we it he's like we had the thirteen thousand dollars from our our parents and then we had to make this work and so they end up creating a bunch of you know fast forward till today they have they have basically like the like they do a billion dollars a year in sales on their toy company this guy is personally a self made billionaire it's a big created toys guru is it z u r u and so they've created a bunch of toys that you've heard of like robo fish i don't know if you've ever heard of that it's like a like a little fake it's a toy fish that'll swim around in a in a jar or like a fish bowl they've created a bunch of balloons which i bought this a bunch of times like you could you put the hose in and it'll fill up a bunch of water balloons all at once and so they they you know the dark blaster they've sold thirty nine million of these or whatever and so they basically built all these like hit viral toys and so and early on what they did like at the beginning what they did was they basically just knock off other good toys like gimmick toys and they would just make them themselves and try to like out execute them so they were like trying to out manufacture them or out distribute them so there'd would be like a light up frisbee that was like hot so he would they would like clone the light up frisbee and then they would go and they would like like to get into retail stores they crashed the like the buyer's dinner for dick's sporting goods and the his sister just like showed up and kinda like sc their way in and got the account and they just did that over and over and over again they you know they and they they would get sued by the companies like hey you're copying our toys they're like yeah okay we gotta create original toys and so they they kinda knocked it off they they brute force their way into retail and then they started create their original toys like bunch of balloons of robo fish and the stuff and so basically they you know they they would basically sell these at walmart wherever and their big thing was like how do we manufacture this with no people so they're like can we do this where it's automated and ten times cheaper than everybody else and so they claim they claim that their factories that have the robots that produce these have like no humans on the line i don't know if this is true because like even like tesla which tried to do this with their factories was not able to do but like maybe maybe it's true or maybe it's like pretty much true like there's very minimal human intervention how did you find this these someone dm remember what i talked about being known well somebody was like you're gonna love this is a perfect bill of the week so by the way remember guys i forgot your name and it looks like him and its brother c founded it and their sister's the coo yeah so they're it's all in the family family owned they own the whole thing i think still and it did basically they have eight thousand employees twenty six offices around the world last year they tripled sales to one point one billion in twenty in twenty twenty one and you know they're still not as big as has bro or mattel or like you know pot pro and gamble which are like has six billion mattel five billion p and g's like you know eighty billion but now they're like launching new new products at new new brands so so they do the toy business they they conquer that becomes a billionaire there there and then he's like alright what can we do next so they go into other products and now they're like alright we're gonna create what does parker and gamble they have products in every category we're gonna do diapers and so they go into the diapers thing with this brand called ras and friends and i think in the first year their ras friends is gonna do two hundred million that's not the first year but last year that they're gonna two hundred million this next year they're projecting it to be four hundred million and so highly profitable just prints cash and the toy business basically prints cash they use it to invest in these so how did the diaper business take off well they saw that hug is partnered with disney and pro and gamble partnered with warner brothers that's why they can do like you know disney or like batman like things like that and so these guys went partner with coco mel which is the youtube like kid sensation and so ras and friends sorry last year was a hundred million this year a hundred fifty million next year projecting two hundred million then they also did this with hair care they have a brand called monday hair then they did pet food with brand called nude they did a collagen brand called dose and they're just trying to replicate this with each thing so the hair brand is gonna do sixty million this year and so there's stacking these on top to each other but then the coup g the biggest one they're trying to do of all of them nice thing called zoo tech so what do they trying to do with azure tech they're basically trying to create a factory that can just build you houses robots that build houses is the the big idea and so they're trying to create the biggest factory on earth the period bigger than tesla's giga factory bigger than all of it so let me let me give you the stats on this thing where is it so they're trying to scale it up to one point six million square meters two kilometers can't even okay so two so that's that's about a mile and a quarter long yeah two two thousand two thousand k yeah two thousand meters yeah they're trying to yeah they're trying to they're trying to hire two thousand more people in the next twenty four months which is just insane and so the their idea with this with this factory for the for the tech thing is it's basically like you can design a home they bay they took a gaming engine like unreal or like unity or whatever and they're like okay if you go into a game like the sims you can like create a house and you could paint the wall and you could put a couch there and then you could put make a floor is different like in the sims you can basically design a house or you could design a whole neighborhood you could design a a large house small house whatever so they're like why don't we do that except it's it's real like when you're done you click print and then the robots basically just make that house and so this is what they're trying to do with this thing which oddly just sounds like you know frankly bizarre but that's what they're doing so that's the that's the new venture that they're spinning out of this called zoo tech and it's basically a way to to use robots to build homes which is just kinda insane that architecture software using a gaming engine what do you think made them so special i mean this guy like i'm looking at them him and he he just seemed like a have you ever met any new zealand guys yeah like they're like the same like the stereotype of like an australian guys like fun loving love to get drunk bad with money we'll spend all their money because they're like they just wanna like be care like a lot of australians don't have a a lot of savings because they just don't mind spending at the bar they're fun loving they're always a blast to be around and that's and that's what this guy like if i had to like just look at i mean this guy seems like he goes all in on things well i think the key to he's a red head key to success so you know red heads they they they have a chip on their shoulder from day one that they're they they got something to prove so i think that's like a that's a big deal that's i would say eighty for real though twenty another twenty percent hard work this is a great fine this guy's cool and he's only thirty five i think yeah so i'm gonna read you some of his tips for success okay you can give me a a thumbs up thumbs down or or or map whatever you know if it's if it's just okay so the first one rethink your vocabulary i never use the word employee because we're high performing team and we're playing different positions i'm coaching the team trying to get the best players at all the positions we have team members not employees in our business what do you think cool i i do the same thing i i i hate calling them employees sometimes i'll use the word staff but i hate using employees right but yeah i thought you just say the help the fuck i would do the same also i'll never like when somebody let's say it work for for you i'm like no you work with me it does exactly what i was gonna say i i always correct people on that oh yeah you know i work for sean no you don't work for sean you work with me and i never say i work for anybody i work with them and it's a it's an arrangement it's a partnership i do x and i get y and you do x if you get y and that's you know hold yourself to that okay next one bullets before cannonball balls because the first thing i learned one of the things i learned early on was to fire bullets both for cannonball balls we're always firing lots of little bullets everywhere to see if those work if they work but then we fire a cannonball behind it i love it that's a good analogy i break the rules i went to university i studied law commerce but i didn't like it to like it to be honest and there was a big big hill i had to walk up every day to get to law school i didn't like that hill either i did it for a year and i thought oh why not i have a why don't i have a crack just doing this work thing so i moved to china i didn't even make my second year of law i missed out which is probably a good thing of blessing in disguise okay yeah i don't really get the the the really move to china but didn't like a hilton did different strokes for different folks but i appreciate it alright don't be shaken by competition so he says in the early days we have this tiny production lab we spent half our money on an injection motor machine we started to produce our hot air balloon which didn't sell many of because it didn't meet regulations globally so we went online and copied a couple of products one was a frisbee we got sued after it we went to a toy fair and we got through day one but the companies we copied came to our booth and yelled at us then we started innovating and it was our journey that took us six or seven years to get successful at product we lived off very very very little we scrapped we scrapped and scraped to find something that would work awesome k yeah very fair alright let me skip it let me see if there's another good one okay don't lose sight he said i remember when we made our first million hey fan of the show we did we did a big deal with david beckham where we made at david beckham tom at walmart i was twenty one at the time we got a twenty eight million dollar order from walmart but we couldn't finance it walmart ended up canceling the whole order we was stuck with half of the tam of ach we were so excited because it was this because this awful amount of money at the time we had no money but we got a little bit complacent we were always checking how we were doing every month and we ended up losing i think two hundred thousand that month we lost a bunch of money we sat down and we thought from this day forward we are never ever gonna have a month where we lose money we took that approach and we would never lost money again we were always profitable this guy is awesome what's his name nick m mow yeah moe mow i think hey if anyone knows nick or can do the introduction to him this guy i would love to have him on the pod this guy's off right this guy don't fine the red head joe love red actually my friend said something really funny he goes yeah my wife he he goes we're i'm doing this deal and like we were dealing with some people i was like i just can't tell if this person's like all hype this is gonna like a charlotte or what and and i was like for some reason they're just not getting along with this other person and i don't know what to make of it he goes oh you goes i've seen this many times of business two char can't be in a room at the same time together they just comb bust they can't stand it he he goes it's like my girlfriend she's a red head she can't she told me once i can't stand being in the room with another red hat and i was like is this the same thing with charlotte and he goes think let know one one is a charlotte one person's a charlotte you put him in the room with another known charlotte they'll hate each other so funny this data is wrong every freaking time have you heard of hubspot hubspot is a crm platform where everything is fully into well i can see the clients whole history calls support tickets emails and here's a test from three days ago i totally missed hotspot spot throw at him our buddy julian has this company called demand curve he's like hey would you speak at this like demand curve conference thing and i'm like you know you know the rule the rule is hell nah we don't do nothing for nobody except if it's our friends that we do it for free right so it's either a big money or a big friend julian big friends i did it for free the so we go on there and i'm like i don't know what this is oh it's a a it's a conference talk about audience building or content or something like that you get that all the time i know and so you go there and you're like gonna do much spiel but something really interesting happened so it was me and this other guy saga from the show called breaking points i bet you're familiar with it have you heard of this or ben you have to know about breaking points so you know what this thing no you guys don't know about this okay this is basically like a like a like a tv show like a podcast you know you know the young turks that that channel on youtube that was like they did know a break board show breaking complaints which is like google blogger and crystal they do their own version of like a political correspondence show or whatever like a i don't even know what you're call political talk show basically and they do it they started off just doing it on youtube or whatever and and it's kinda of blown up and so this he was the guy was on the panel with me and there was a few things he said that i was like really taking notes on i was like that's really smart and also this what this guy's doing is actually pretty awesome and i think could get huge like it looks on the surface sort of goofy it looks like kids playing dress up because it's like they they made it look like a talk show so they're like at a desk he wears a suit and tie you know so it's like but it's like you know is it like a lip a liberal news it's like a liberal a young turks or is it like conservative i don't know how they would call it i'm not very political so i don't really even wanna say i don't wanna mis classified it but it's the their stick is like they they cover the things are they say the things that the mainstream media is not covering or i do their covering these stories or they're just like spinning it for their own agenda and they're like we'll just try to say the truth like what we think the truth is and i would just call it like we see it which again everybody says with the question is like how close are you to actually doing that it's like company values every company says integrity is our core value as they like you know destroy the earth and so and so that's what these guys do and so they they have the set and it like looks like you you went to like you know when you go to like kfc in like china and it's like i i don't know when i do that you've a been somewhere right i do i don't know canada where where where have you gone sam yeah you know like on friday nights when you're like are at domino's in tokyo you like you know that failing sorry i had to big dog there with my international experience but yeah basically they're this like i lived in china and they this phrase n qr like i i'd be like i go to mcdonald's here but i don't really like i know why they're like oh ten qr we'll ten qr not quite right and it's the perfect description which is it's almost exactly right but it's not quite right and my all of us my all my asian friends say it's same same but different yeah yeah exactly same same but different like this this knock off nike shoe it's same same i'm just different exactly so anyways that's like what these guys show looks like it looks almost like a knock off show that's kind of the that you know my initial judgment then i started watching it and they got on joe rogan and i was like wow this and joe loves the show joe's like joe basically he was telling me just now he goes i go how'd you get all rogan and he's like ro was just a fan of the show and he just reached out was like hey i love the show guys and they're like wow we kinda didn't think we like you know we had like most people like early on you kinda feel like i might doing the right thing i quit my job to do this it's not big huge on youtube it who's was on youtube and how many views an episode they'll have like i don't like eight hundred thousand subscribers or something like that so they're doing go like media now but this was like before that joe got on it well joe was like into it when it was pretty early and he's was like they're were like wow joe rogan amazing if the number one podcast in the world thinks this is like awesome maybe we're on to something so just kept going and then joe invited them on the show and then they're they they have launched like a paid subscription because they're like hey look like if you go to their website it just says help us what is it a breaking point that kinda what does the the title say goes like help us beat mainstream media or stuff like that like help us defeat mainstream media or like cover the stories that that'll covers some like it it painted them as an enemy which is great like just a smart smart like marketing tactic basically but but basically they so so joe their first show the first page show joe rogan came on and so you know they like had this like amazing way to like kinda kick off but that's because they had put in a few years of like hard work before that it's like four years old now and so he said a couple things that i thought were really smart i'm gonna share them here in fact i actually think we should just run the whole interview we just did with him like as of my first million episode if they're those guys were down it because i thought there's a bunch of interesting things one thing he could they go how'd you get started like how'd you get your first thousand customers and and or or like subscribers or whatever and we all get asked this a bunch i rarely do you hear something that interesting but he said a pretty interesting answer he goes well here's what i did i saw that in my niche there were these people that were already like popular accounts and so it's was like i just went and looked at who are the top one percent of of like popular accounts already and then i just decided okay the first content i create is just gonna be content that they love because if they love it they'll share it they'll kind of endorse it and that'll drive a bunch of growth right away of the right audience and so what he did with was he's like okay they they have this they need data they need visualizations they need charts cool so i just gonna or they need transcripts like quick transcripts of like what trump just said they need to have like the edited well formatted transcript so he's like we weren't doing our own opinions and analysis no i would just sit there and i would live when trump was talking i'm transcribing it i cleaned it up i formatted it i have the first to post trump said this and then those guys would reread it he's like and that's how i got my first like ten thousand subscribers he's like after you get ten thousand there's psychologically the thing where you'll just start growing faster because people wanna follow popular accounts what it what it been well what was your advice though to these people on growing an audience my advice was pretty simple i go i don't think you should grow an audience for the sake of growing an audience like the audience is basically a byproduct of you doing something else you really wanna do like if you just got that itch you wanna scratch like i wanna create content i don't i i've seen youtubers i think i could do it that's actually a better reason to go do it then if i can get to a million subscribers then i'll upsell my merch to this percentage and i can make this much money it's like don't do the calculating way to do it just be like i'm doing this because either like in my case it was i'm super curious about these topics and like how am i gonna justify spending nine hours reading about this bullshit topic that like i had i have no agenda for well if i had a podcast or in a youtube channel then i could just like make the content out of that then it has like a kind of like a purpose to my curiosity i have like an endpoint to it i have a justification for my curiosity i get to be professionally curious or like lately when i when i originally started the pod i literally wrote this in a doc i've shared this before i wrote most likely nobody's gonna listen to this but there's a hack really smart and interesting successful people are willing to go on a podcast even if it has they don't know how many listeners it has and so at the very like my main goal is to just have an excuse to meet with fifty awesome people that live in san francisco like i'm in the tech hub of the unit the world san francisco and i don't drink coffee so i don't wanna just invite these guys to coffee i'll invite them on my podcast instead that was my whole like number one success criteria and like number one agenda with like starting this podcast was oh it's a great excuse to hang out with these people that are like they're nearby they're in my orbit and don't do it and like i i know it's better than saying let me just get lunch with you please please please and so that was why i started the pod dude i have like people ask me all the time as well how to build an audience and i used to have like somewhat academic answer where i'm like well you just gonna like find content that like ranks all all other places and you repurpose do all this this is and lately i've just like quit saying that and i just go well just like be an interesting person live an interesting life it'd just be at least kind of okay at talking about it publicly right because the thing you just said like if you're interesting if you lead an interesting life then all you have to do is share ten percent of it and you only have to be okay to talk about it give people us a peek into ten percent of your life yeah and you don't even need to be that great and so people like over optimized for like this like the like you know it's kinda like when people talk about search they're like well you need all those keywords and do this through this and i'm like or i just do dope shit and write it and people just gonna go straight to the website and look it up and that's harder and i still think you need that other stuff but like i i still think that it's mostly a game of just be interesting learn interesting stuff and be kinda good at talking about it so everyone else can consume and like there are people that do it ways like trunk who used to work for you at the hustle you kinda discovered him you set up i think his twitter account now he's got like whatever i don't know a million twitter followers something crazy and i don't think chung took that advice like i don't think trump lives a interesting life or has this interesting business experience that's what he's sharing well he's he he learns about interesting he but yes that is true and so he did dig that you could make make sure right you could make the argument yeah but you could also make the argument that he's leaving leading an interesting life in that he's learning and discovering cool stuff so that's like you you could make the argument both ways but i remember i'm not i i hate saying this because i'm definitely not like a ladies man but i've come a long way from being like a napoleon guy might like males man yeah i'm more of a male i'm a guy's guy but not the way that you think it the way that it's usually been like our medi guys guy and but i've come a long way for from looking like the napoleon a died and i remember like i had some like eighteen year old asked me about like meeting girls and i was like shocked i was like your your your bar for advice is quite low here but let me give you some advice if i could give anything which was basically i'm like you'll meet more women if you just focus on yourself and have cool badass hobbies and just invite people to come and do those hobbies with you and i was like that's the that's the coolest hack ever for a a young man you just do dope shit and then you just bring along people and that's kinda like that with content yeah that's the exactly right i think there are a bunch of different ways to win you could be like ben for how to take over the world i would say he's curious about these you know great man in history or like these you know these sort of like biographies or whatever and then what he does he does a service he says i'll save you time so i call him a time saver because he packages it down into something concise the hustle newsletter and milk roads newsletter is exactly that it's a time saver so what do you curate you package you deliver then you have like you know sort of like a remix a remix basically takes maybe one or two unrelated things spins them together puts them together and and and puts that out there you have an original that's like a naval or apology they're coming up with like independent thesis about the world and opinions and analyses that that really just originate from them and they put that out in the world and then you have what i'll call like a lifestyle influencer that's what you're talking about which was bleed an interesting life share ten percent it so there's all these different play styles that you can use it's like in a video game that you wanna play tank you wanna play dps you wanna play healer you could play all these different roles and they'll all they're all winning you just have to know which play style you're trying to play so i see that with with content but the one use you recommend it which is live string life and then share ten percent of it i think that that is the most fun play style to play and the most valuable table and the most valuable and the most unique because anybody honestly i don't no offense trunk trump but like many people do and anybody can go read fucking reddit it and wikipedia and like create a threat of you know here's the story of how whatever the dude created starbucks and it's like guy the the one that's repeatedly done is is the hot sauce guy what's the hot sauce guy yeah everyone talks about that guy and that guy is the king of the thread boys yeah every thread boy at home has like a small bottle of sri on a shrine and they're like i'll always remember the day i can tell people that sri started in thailand or the peppers were so bad that the neighbors of the factory hated him and they don't even advertise and it's the sam bottle since day one yeah hot dog is still a dollar fifty cents yeah like this is this disease like you know classic but the one you said was the most i think at the most rewarding place style and my trainer had a great phrase for this because i was like i was asking about his business i was like i was trying to help him with his business and he ended up dropping like like i thought i'm i'm the business guy i'm gonna share with him this great knowledge and i was like you gotta think about your niche your audience who's your idea you know who's your customer persona and i was like just looking back you know just cringe city about like trying to help him with these things and he just said i was like you don't have a you have a business car i'm blah blah and he just go and i was like who's you know you gotta know who's your customer he goes my customers are people that love what i do and i was like i was like okay that sounds like some smooth ass rm and b lyric but what does that mean what are you gonna do with that he's like and and i didn't understand at that time but he just let he's like that's he's like my customers are gonna be the people that love what i do what and he's like said okay well what do he do he's like i'll train you on your fitness and during that during that session i'll train your mind as much as your body right it's mindset and because the mindset totally aligned with this stuff and that's what i'm into and i'll just share with you stuff that i'm doing with my own training with my own mindset training or my personal training i'll work out with you together sometimes and i'll come to your house and we'll just kick it for hours i don't i don't watch the clock right like that's how i wanna live and people my customers are gonna be people who want that and i'm not gonna try to go backwards and say what does the market want i'm gonna conform myself to it and so there was this real artist streak to it i thought alright well that sounds cool but like that shit done work in the real world sure enough how do they work i was his only client i think at the time and he and we work out like in my garage but we just leave the garage open and then people walk by and they walked by he never he never he just super friendly with him but never says like hey by the way you if you ever interested my services here's my card never like they would walk by he would joke around with them sort of like just a flirt of people and then he would just like you know go back and keep doing everything thing he's just a happy guy by like the seventh day people are like man it looks like y'all are having fun the music looked fun the home gym they saw us like setting it up each day would get better they saw us joking around they would see my you know i'm breaking a sweat they would see howard we're using like we'd use our tree and we'd use all this stuff that was just around us because i didn't have all this equipment and it just looked like two people having a lot of fun and so my neighbor so so bunch of there's a bunch of sweaty shirtless guy's hugging you know just hanging off the trees and just the does body and so guess what people wanted some of that and so my neighbor signs up and her husband signs up then the other neighbor signs up then my sister's is visiting she doesn't work out she signs up my mom signs up my brother last signs up she their niece my niece and nephew sign up everybody starts signing up this guy now is a full roster still never had a website never had a business card never went and knocked on a door or try to do a sales pitch all these people are confirmed their schedules to him he's not even a trainer he just a guy just comes there hangs out talk the best part least he's me there's not a trainer probably dude who won't have sex with you i even know what's called who just hang out with you i got a guy you you either got come hang out with you i got a guy but long story short this phrase of who are my customers the people that love what i do that is like playing in my opinion business at the highest level because it is the most freeing imagine if that was true that's the most freeing thing you could do right same thing with content creation who are who how am gonna get subscribers i'm gonna grow my audience well i'm just gonna do the most interesting things i'm a share it as i go and the people who follow we be gonna be the people who love what i do and like that is just i think a much better way to go than like this frankly a sort of desperate approach that i think most people take to building a business and getting customers getting subscribers all that stuff dude let me show you an example of i think might be the exact opposite of what we're talking about so i have been researching and i think someone's dan on this on twitter but i found this thing called strong land like the the word strong and then the word land strong land publishing his main thing is called life math money alright check this out so this guy he owns maybe half a dozen to a dozen i've i found like four or five so far different twitter handles one is is called the forty eight laws of power bot or quote bot i believe another one is called the book of p p o o k and the forty eight laws a power bot quote or quote bot it's just like he's got a ton of quotes loaded into this and it has maybe two or three hundred thousand followers another one is called the book of p i think that's how you pronounce p p o o k and he's just like quoting like this pickup artist from the early two thousand that no longer writes and then he owns a handful of more of these like just twitter handles that are just like generic and they're all basically focused four men and it's about getting laid meeting girls making money getting fit and he owns like six or twelve of these handles which is obviously like not the hardest thing to grow because it's like these cool taboo topics so like it's one of those things where we don't talk about your friends but everyone wants to be better at all those things so you follow these these guys and he like has like a circular thing where he like re tweets each one and each handle links off to a gum road page that sells a document related to that so like the forty eight laws is a power one it's like here's how you get more powerful power here's how you get more power and influence at your job which like who doesn't wanna learn that and he sells it for eighty nine dollars and then another one's is like here's a bunch of lines to pick up girls here's like a workout plan to get abs in eight weeks or here's like the perfect way to eat healthy and feel good and if i had to guess i would say that he's doing between five hundred and a million dollars a year in sales just off these gum road things so because you can see the sales so basically not the sales the reviews i think no it's a sale so like for example oh wow live intentionally ninety day self improvement program it's i think it cost eighty nine dollars and it says nine thousand five hundred and six sales how much is that is that nine hundred that's half a million that's half a million bucks and i don't know how long right so maybe this has been off for years and i think he's only been doing it for two years and then there's like you know his crypto one there's his like you know build or twitter audience and how much is that how many how many did that sell so that has five thousand four hundred sales so on how much dollars let's see i want like a hundred bucks how much is it hundred seventy nine dollars so golly so his twitter one has generated a million dollars his next one has generated five hundred thousand dollars so i think pretty safe to say he's doing at least half a million a year probably closer to a million isn't that funny is this is this hilarious this little guy and his name is harsh strong man i believe his name so it's like an anonymous name and his blog is called life math money dot com and if you go to and look up who is harsh strong men and he says i'm a certified financial planner in india and i guess he he just has this blog and he talks about those stuff and and i think it's cool i think there's this anonymous blogger who only uses a some type of like free ish looking website builder and gum road is just killing it and i think it's awesome that's amazing that is this is hilarious it's awesome right when i think about a harsh strong man a man who just em body's life math and money i think of an indian a mid twenties independent indian certified financial planner no like the a alpha like you know this is my cousin paper i just found out what desk for a living there's a reason alpha and accountant both start with a this guy's this guy's is alpha as they can get the alpha accountant is gonna be his new thing and is gonna have he's gonna have a twitter handle on like excel courses it times your bitch yeah that's what the andrew tate of excel alright dude i on air i need you to help me make a decision alright alright so i am in the process of i'm i stopped in saint louis i'm recording this from saint louis but i'm driving from new york to austin i always stop in saint louis for five days to see family i'm gonna drive back to austin i miss new york i miss brooklyn already i you missed the energy there's something about the city the city there you have to go romantic when you talking be york for some reason that's why refuse to go there i love it i love it i like i'm in grind mode i love being there but there's one thing that i'm currently doing that is it it's it is something that i told myself i'm not gonna do it and that is bitch about taxes and let taxes decide where i live i'm one hundred percent doing that right now so i wanna tell you some numbers so i currently live in texas which has no state income i think the federal what what's the the federal tax tax rate for the highest income it's what's at thirty six percent or thirty seven six issue alright so i think it's a little above a thirty thirty six percent so hypothetically on a million dollars of income i'm spending three hundred and seventy thousand dollars a year on taxes or around thirty thirty one thousand yeah federal because texas doesn't have income so thirty one thousand dollars a month in tech sorry thirty one thousand a month yeah which adds up to about thirty three hundred and seventy a year in new york if i move there i would basically be giving away fifty one to fifty two percent of my income because the city of new york has like a three point eight percent tax rate and then the state of new york has a nine point seven percent tax rate and so that means i'm i would have to be spending an additional eleven thousand five hundred dollars a month in income taxes plus if i to new york rent that's the new york state rent that's not gonna be rent of your place yeah yes plus the to rent of a place my current mortgage right now in austin is around four thousand to five thousand dollars a month i would not wanna purchase a place in brooklyn i would wanna rent a place and my budget to renting to have a family there would be around nine thousand to fourteen thousand dollars a month in rent probably thirteen probably probably eleven to twelve i could probably get a a place that i would want and that's what i would spend so i would be spending just and then let's say my income this is all hypothetical i'm not saying what i do or don't make if my income is two million i'm gonna be spending around two hundred and eighty thousand dollars a year in extra income taxes plus an additional hundred and fifty thousand dollars a year in rent meaning my costs are gonna be like four hundred to five hundred thousand dollars a year in additional costs just to live there not including the fact that like i'm in saint louis right now i just want not to eat for three people fifty one dollars if i'm in new york for three people for breakfast it's gonna be you know like yeah a hundred bucks two times the cost so how would you justify making the move or not move well i kinda did myself right because i live in california and california has the same problems that new york has high cost of living high state tax that sort of deal and now and and i you know i work remote i could live anywhere at this point and so you know it is very tempting especially when you hear like you meet people who who live in texas then you meet people who live in puerto rico they're like you pay federal thirty seven percent i pay four percent you i'd pay zero percent on capital gains like wow alright i guess that's also an option so there's sort of like no end to it and i know i used to live in indonesia and you know for two grand a month or three grand a month like you know you're living large out there so like you know you could have a i i had a cook and a maid that lived in my house i had a driver that drove me everywhere and like you know we didn't have to think about anything so there really is no end to this idea of like optimizing cost of living versus you know like what you wanna do there is no end to it but maybe there are thresholds yeah there's there's more rung to the ladder than even what you presented i guess what i'm trying to say you could either you can take it even further i think that i've always thought as sort of like goes back to that what you know what advice would my eighteen year old self give me my eighteen year old self which was like a more simple minded version myself would say this doesn't mean the right but they would say this wait i thought you're rich like oh you wait you're wait so you're moving to where you don't wanna live to save money that sounds not very rich right so if it's the same if you if it's all the same in terms of where you enjoy living cool then obviously pick pick the difference if you enjoy one more i would go to it now it's the hard part is how do you price that enjoyment me how do you price that energy of new york how do you want dollar on we're we're gonna put a dollar amount we're guys we're we're gonna price that we're gonna say it's around four or five hundred thousand but dude for the same price i can live in texas six months and in new york six months and fly private back and forth twice actually like two round trips and it'd still be cheaper but that's yeah but i i would also add hassle to your life right so there's there's some situations where the variety adds what you want right it's like a win win it's like oh yeah i don't wanna be in one place all year anyways or i like the weather this time of year in one place and this time in another place so i'm just gonna move around the weather and that happens to coincide well with my tax situation but basically my thought my my simple thought process is this if you're rich you can do tax optimizations but make sure it's not driving the car right so it gets to be in the car but it doesn't drive the car so i would do some things that are no sweat that are gonna save you tax money oh great i would do that i would not move which is like one of the biggest things that changes your like day to day quality of life i would moved to a different place just like based on taxes as the primary reason i would have to have another primary reason so for example my reason for being in california is that me and my wife's family is all here and i just wanna see them more often and have that be like i prefer that lifestyle don't know how many years we all have left where we're all healthy or my kids are little and they get to have this experience with the grandparents around but that matters more to me than than anything on the tax side so that's my decisive reason i made that one reason the priority and then i'll live with the rest i think that's what you should do you should come up with your one decisive of reason about where you're gonna live and i would guess if you're rich that reason should not be taxes i gotta do it unfortunately but golly it sucks in the back of my head it's that famous michael jordan quote you i mean that's something joke the for the great crow of jordan is republicans buy shoes too that is a my first million worthy quote you but also you know you also got a factor in and how much more are you gonna make how much more is maybe the connections you'll make in new york one investment you make you know you can make more it's easier to make more for a guy like a you guys like us than it is to adjust your lifestyle to try to save more i i find it i would rather work harder to make more money than change my lifestyle and in a a way that i feel like i'm i'm making some compromise in order to save money well i think i'm gonna do it i if i could do this again for some reason i think miami is just like hell on earth it's not for some reason i could name about fifty reasons why i think that i think miami horrible but at the same time if i could do it again i almost wish i would have so right now i live in austin texas is because i got a bunch of friends there my best friends are there and we had an officer there if i could have done it again i would have done florida though and new york because texas doesn't have nice enough weather that i'm just going just for the weather during wintertime whereas florida like you know you can i like i'm the caribbean sometimes in certain parts of it i wish i would've done florida new york if i can do it again that's what i wish i would have done i'm surprised the best friends being an austin i thing it's not a bigger pull for you i feel like that's huge it is and that's why i'm i'm i don't actually mean if i could do it again i wish if the stars would have aligned so that could have happened is kinda what i mean what slap in the face i'm just glad i'm not your friend i'm not neville who lives right door you at austin who's like oh the energy in new york that's what's gonna get you and you're gonna move away from me for the the energy come on bro dude new york's happen man it is quite fun it is fun whenever i walk around there i get pumped i do get pumped but i also like also i also wanna kill like i i wanna kill someone at the time i dude like every time i'm in line at whole foods or some grocery store they're i see a fight it's this there's always a commotion there's always commotion it's all something's always happening and it always raises my blood pressure and i wanna like get in like protector mood that's hilarious alright what else we wanna do some more yeah i have one thing if so i think we've talked about this and we've just you and i have hired this guy but go to dream studio course dot com his name is kevin shen and i went and looked at his landing page this guy's landing page for a course a is awesome and b he's selling a course that i never in a million years would have thought would work but then i look at it and i think one hundred percent you've nailed it and i understand how you could potentially make a million dollars a year so it's called dream studio course and it's a fifteen hundred dollar course i don't know why he didn't just go two thousand but it's a fifteen hundred dollar course all on setting up your your zoom setup basically because i don't even think it's for a podcast but crazy cool looking landing page and whenever i when i saw his landing page i thought wow i really want this right but how sick is that landing page it's a great landing it's a great landing page for a bunch of different reasons like first just start with headline so headline is not a course about setting up your zoom it says make your home video set up look like hollywood right dream outcome so sells the dream outcome right away then there's a picture of him that's you know that shows a really awesome video setup so you know show don't tell and then he basically says build your studio with expert help it's a six week course that'll do whatever okay enroll here a good call to action and then he's got a bunch of before and after right here's tia four look he looked like shit before now it looks great right you know look here's is this person now they look great and he just keeps showing you know basically success stories of transformations because fundamentally when people buy a course they're buying transformation of some kind they wanna walk in one way and walk out another and most courses i've struggled with this myself most courses struggle to even understand that you're selling change you're selling a transformation not content not information and secondly they don't know how to show that i can actually provide this for you and with something that like the visual like this you're gonna get a before and after which is like before and after is my favorite sales pitch of all time think before and after is the most compelling sales pitch do you have like a file or something that has all you're you're you're saying this as if you have like a like categories of headlines of headlines or of well you're like you're like oh he's doing the before and after style headline i love that style yeah i have the in so in my course i teach this these i'm like here's a bunch of frames you can use to like sell your product if you can do like this yeah yeah well if this yeah you used before and after if it's not visual there's another one i call stop the struggle so stop the struggle you sent me this landing page actually abstract ops used to have this landing page i think you invest in those guys they it was like a stick figure running away from a tornado and it just said stop putting off your back office your back back office tasks or like stop running away from your your your your to do list or whatever and that's what i call a stop the struggle pitch which is basically saying instead of saying what we do for you will say we can put you out of your pain is that pain hurting you i can stop the pain for you i could stop the struggle that you're having right he could do the same thing so he does dream outcome before and after right like make your home video set up look like hollywood he could also have a stop the struggle which is like you know you know basically a a stop showing up to work looking like this and it's like the up the nose camera shot blah blah blah and it's like instead you could look like this after and so you know so based i have these different frames that i'm like this is a way that you can present your product your information and so because i have a one of my sessions in my courses as a landing page one and so that's why i'm like you this is where you need to use this it's on your landing page because your landing page is your twenty four seven salesman that will always deliver the pitch exactly as they were trained to do twenty four seven anywhere in the world never have a sick day and take no commission on sales and so like landing page is the greatest salesman whenever and so i think you should train your salesman to like be able to sell your product effectively essentially i i'm writing a a new landing page now for my thing and it is daunting like it no matter how many landing pages i've written it is always hard well because your board keeps going up because you're like oh i know what great looks like i know i want it to be great and so what would have otherwise been sufficient five years ago now you look at that you're like no i'm sure it can be better i know it can be better because you're already really you're really good if i was gonna get somebody right at landing any page i would i are you and so you're already very good at it so the fact that you're feeling da is like i don't know like a musician going back into the studio to record their new album and it's like they know that they're good but it's like i gotta do it i gotta make magic again i make a hit again that's exactly how i feel i'm staring at this landing page and i'm like no this is lame this isn't up to my standard this sucks this sucks and i'm just like looking for you know what i what i usually do is what i like to do is find the way that i'm beginning inspiration now is i find competitors that exist now or that used to offer a similar service and i go to newspapers dot com and i find old articles written about them and i see how reporters used to explain this and if i see a catchy sentence i go boom got it i'm still in that angle and so that's what i that's how i've been using that's how i've been getting inspiration is i just use newspapers dot com to find old just articles in new york times written about a certain company that's in the same space there was this guy and we hired once and i actually don't think it was a smart hire i made a bunch of mistakes now i think about and looking back at my business i'm like man we hired a firm to do that like you know we hired this person to do this we paid this like i remember out of the indy five hundreds like was doing their race or whatever and it was like hey you there's free billboard space we can give it to you for your app and then i was like oh wow that's cool indy five hundred i've heard of they're giving us free space and i we spent the next forty eight hours like filming this fucking video that was gonna go on this billboard this like video billboard and i was like i'm looking back i'm like oh my god i how cheap was my attention that i let this random cold email divert me and my marketing team's like focus for forty eight hours to do what like do we really think this billboard was going to at indy five hundred eighty five hundred drive downloads it was a beer your app so yeah this it was on point but like they're just not trying to download apps in that moment and like weird it was no way to track it it was it was awful and so like and that's happened to me a thousand times i made a thousand dumb decisions like that i'm like wow we really like spent time and energy doing that that's like kind of embarrassing now that i know what i know now so similarly we had hired a naming agency like i hired an agency i don't think that's a horrible idea i don't think that's the worst idea i think it was fifteen or twenty five grand it was a lot of money and it took like six weeks which is also more expensive was like if you just had the name we would have just moved faster what was the name that they came come up with i even remember i was like that dating but we were doing is that like what they just came back with like jersey short characters your app is called the situation so we were thinking what's sophisticated but also fun party to the front yeah so so basically in poly d say it with me poly d the latest and greatest day who's like and so so anyways it wasn't even that they did a bad job they actually did a good job with their thing but it was just unnecessary it was unnecessary thing to do but i i do respect the craft because i remember i went to this to the to the meeting room it's got eli was sitting there i think eli alt and this his name i and he was like okay so tell me it and i was like so here's the screen and he's like no just like tell me about it i'm like what's an app that lets you do this and has these features say like no like why don't you make the app and it's like oh because i'm at the time was single was like i'm single i've used dating apps and and he's like i was like they just they all sucked and so that's why we want her make this great one and i like i was kept rushing into the here's my answer here's my solution he's like like you said it's sucked what's sucked like what's sucked about it i was like well they're just like too hard to use again generic and he's like so like what did you like do you remember just getting really frustrated about it one time so he's asking me these good questions to like actually unfold the unpack the customer stories the words the phrases that actually means something he got beyond the jargon and then i was like okay so what happens now now you guys you know have this crazy brainstorming exercise where you come up with the name he's was like no just like give me some time and he just took a whiteboard marker and he just sat down cross legged like you know like indian style in front of a whiteboard on the floor and i was like a child yeah and he was literally like a child that play and he like he just like put his phone at silent and put it outside and i was like whoa skype me you like there's no bigger sign of seriousness than somebody could put turns their phone off and like leaves it outside of the room and he's like he just started writing and he started writing long form like not i was like oh he's got some names and i went there to get away for names he's no he was like you know dating is like part actually it's not hard it's just kind of it's it's frustrating well the thing that's frustrating about it is like i know that i'm a good catch but i'm sitting here trying to perform and he's just like writing out like the feelings that go through the mind or the person that the this the way the story needs ed is it's the most like weirdest horrible thing like he's just thoughtful thing and it comes up with like dick butt like basically that's basically it so he you know so he he did this long process and i actually think that there's a there's some military phrase which is like slow is smooth and smooth this fast yeah and i've always tried to go fast when it comes to business stuff how do i go faster how do we speed this up and i'd paid the price many times where like if i had just slowed down at the per on the appropriate step the whole thing would have gone faster even though that step would have gone slower for example figuring out what is the actual problem i'm solving what are the what is the pain that the person is feeling here what are the words that they would use to describe it that they would that would resonate with them and get them to nod their head it'd be like yeah i've had that and then how would i explain it in a way that's simple to them like that's what he was ultimately trying to he was trying to figure out what's the problem what are the words that somebody would actually use that would resonate with them where they'd nod and be like you know a man preach like i i've i feel that you wow you just you put it in words better than i even could how i was feeling about this situation and then oh you describe the solution but instead of describing it in terms of like the features and the the widgets and the gadgets around it like you tell me kinda like how my life's is gonna be different because i'm using this and this works this different way and it kinda makes sense that it would work that way right because you know let's use an analogy you imagine you ran lemonade san and blah blah and so that's what he did and i remember just walking out of that being like wow that was like an impressive thing this guy did and it looked so uni unemployed he asked me some questions he kept slowing me down didn't wanna jump to an answer then he just sat with a marker alone in a room and wrote for a long time on the whiteboard like paragraphs of stuff and then through that it came out with like you know a deep a better understanding about my product than i had to begin with and i think that that like there's something cool about that process and like yeah going we you when you go make this landing page it's like that's the thing you actually wanna do because slow and smoother the smooth as fast well did you did i show you that i hired a branding agency i saw that yeah you sent me the like i think i spent fifteen grand on it and they're based there in hong kong so like i think there was a a like a i think normally this would cost thirty grand in america and i was actually happy with the work and this is normally something i would never do and it took them thirty days and it's like you just get this deck that like outlines and like i never would have done that and i think it was totally worth it this is not something i ever would have done and i think it was because whenever you like build shit and you make a website you slowly iterate and then like you hire new people and you're and they like come up with ideas and you're like no already tried that or like no that doesn't work because this page looks like this like it's i'm like let's just get it all do it all the right way the first time and that's something i never in a million years would have done and it was worth it yeah we did that for the milk road too we hired the sky jeremy who did our initial branding and i've never hired a branding agency like that for for startup but i was doing but i was like alright i told ben i said we're not gonna do it off the bat like you're you saying you're doing it up upfront i think that's okay i don't think that's necessarily bad but i also don't think it's necessary and so usually first if you just kinda wanna do what's say off the bat i already had a quarter of a million in revenue yeah yeah exactly so i had told ben i said he's like he made a logo like in five minutes on canvas and i was like alright i like this i like the hey mil crow sounds fun goofy easy to say you i can get the domain for two thousand dollars let's do it and he maybe this logo in like fiber or can or something like that and i like alright let's run with it he's like you know don't you think we should blah blah i was like alright here's the deal it seems like you wanna spend more cycles on it because you think the brand is important and i agree the brand will be important i just don't think it's important for us to get our first ten thousand subscribers or even a hundred thousand subscribers so let's make a deal if we can get to a hundred thousand subscribers through our junky thing that will will reward ourselves by investing in the brand because i think ultimately the brand the this whole exercise of like having a cool brand it's really for our own pride more so than it's gonna improve the like conversion of this right now or like it's unproven how that's gonna do so let's let's reward ourselves so we got to a hundred thousand and then we hired this guy and then he took us through these like cycles and you know like you know review after review of these like decks and my we're good i is this guy in india who's like my designer for all my projects and to create that milk band character who i think is actually the best part of the brand he actually made it this guy in india made it in like one day and while was like wow perfect thank you that's exactly what i wanted thank you so much and so we just like ran with that dude i think i think the outcome was actually quite good i loved your brand no i thought it was good i thought it was a i you the story right when i went a vacation to hawaii and the the god jeremy he lives there he lives in in hawaii and he's like oh you're here like let's hang out i was like yeah great and so he comes to the hotel he walks up barefoot i was like something happened like the it just did okay and he's like he's like what you mean i was like you don't wearing shoes dude and he's like oh i don't wear shoes i was like you don't wear shoes and i was like most fucking branding agency thing i've ever heard of most creative is it a white guy respect for taking the i'm a creative to the the the the peak like you thought the bean bags in the office was it you thought that you know having these lights is it like a a white guy who moved to hawaii or is he born like i moved to i was like i moved to hawaii when they moved there they were like oh we don't need to shoes on the island like we we just live where part of the island and so they put their shoes in storage and so he's was yeah had to go travel to australia to go visit family he's like i go get my shoes out of storage i was like what a weirdo you don't need to shoes that much that you didn't even just chuck it in the garage like you just in case like you you put them far away like that's the equivalent of the guy the branding needs agency i putting his phone on turning off and leaving it outside the there just same for the record i'm on board with that i think she's are stupid i walk around barefoot at all the time when it gets above if it's eighty above eighty five no shirt no shoes just that's that's just the rule i'm always outside shirt what i'm wearing talk right now no i these i i hate where packaged no man i you gotta get the call on there and then you then you it's like you wear shoes anyway i dig it but i'm happier you're back we went i went we i had ryan holiday on and we'll do a recap about that and then yeah i leave for one day you guys do a podcast about how great hitler is i was like wow alright yeah yeah that that we we had a switch up things up basically we did this pod on hit on hitler and i was talking about how sad it was and then our freaking youtube guy i he like put up the stupid thumbnail and it said like things or no things that can learn from call things or or something about like it was about like like you know things you could learn from hitler on business building and i was like whoa no not a chance and i texted it bad i go bed you gotta get rid of this this is that's not at all what we talked about this is you know i and i had my face on it we had my face next and i was like dude that's not even remotely what we talked about we talked about how horrible he was and so yeah we talked about hitler and had ryan holiday on just when right when you left yeah so i decided to come back i cut my emergency short to come back i got fuck man i can't let you totally throw our youtube guy under the bus because he did contact me he even he was like hey i think i'm gonna do the hitler angle i think it'll get tons of clicks but obviously it'll be controversial do you think that's cool and i was like yeah i mean go for it at anything for clicks more youtube you're like and you're like yeah put sam's face on it while you're at it not my face only sales you've brighten the image bright this speaks it it turns out the color balance yeah you get damn i'm doing like heart shape with his hands it was the worst man i saw that picture and i was like man i can't have this man you gotta delete it immediately please delete that right this is i guess the the recent thought it was okay is because in the first thirty seconds of the video you say hillary obviously a bad person but i don't think it's wrong to like study his life and learn lessons from it and so i was like well he says he's a bad person in the first eight seconds of the video i think it's okay you ever heard that phrase if you're explaining you're losing yeah if you're you're explaining you're losing that is act that is totally right it i was like it didn't it didn't work that that that was a that was a i understand people like that episode but multiple people were like my favorite episode you know i've i just shared it i know if you saw those tweets so it was probably people really like that episode yeah and they also like the ryan holiday one so basically you're welcome you're welcome for they're carrying the load for a while i'm gonna take a this november i'm thinking about doing a motorcycle trip and i'll be going for five days so you're gonna have to see if you can i got you carrie yeah you're obviously if you you can carry the weight during that time yeah why you know why why stalin is so misunderstood yeah i we could talk about this another time but do you know that youtube channel ghost town living yeah that's i those guys the that abandoned town and they they kind of vlog about yeah know as it as they've been building it out or whatever so i invested in it and it's like me and ryan nathan barry and like three or four other guys and i wrote a think i i gave him twenty five grand so i think i own like less than one percent of it but i'm wanna i wanna ride a motorcycle there and and check it out it's like four hours outside of la i think it'd be fun that's interesting why do you invest in that well you can ride your motorcycle there anyways so what what do you think like this is gonna become a valuable investment or no it was an emotional thing no it's it's there it was an emotional thing my justification was it was like me ryan brent the guy on there my friend brendan in like three and nathan barry and like and then only three other entrepreneurs so it's seven of us and i figure well if i can like somehow like get invited to like a thing there or get to talk to them and i've invested twenty five grand i bet i can make that money back just off these relationships or just like a cool story like so that's kinda how i thought about it and i thought and i asked nathan well and so i did for that reason and i also i did the whole deal without seeing any documents and just talking to nathan nathan barry wrote me a text he goes just so you know there's a little bit of room if you wanna join this here's the pros and here's the cons here's why i did it and he and i go okay cool i'm in then because you just said you're in i'm in because you're you know i trust him so that's it was that's simple that's great yeah i think it's a good idea okay cool and i have by the way i have a couple bang topics i'm in a like i have a a lot of research going on right now and i'm excited there's some that i'm like i'm like they're almost so good it might need to be its own episode like i wanna do one that's basically breaking down like what's actually going on with vr like is vr kinda like dead in the wall is it low killing it like that sort of thing and so we've been doing a bunch of research on that share it with me yeah and we'll do a whole episode on it on monday and i'll be the straight man and i'll ask two questions like i don't know anything okay sounds good i think in these basically it's good as is but i think it can be louder i actually wanna go talk to a bunch of like the vr app developers to be like y give me the real deal like what are you like here's what the data tells me but like what you know do you agree your discreet so i wanna talk to a few other experts which normally i don't do that and normally it's like either that happened already accidentally spontaneously yeah you're not doing it's capital j journalism yeah so this time i'm kinda like i don't know going further for some reason but i it's i think it's it because i actually want the answer because i wanna know if i should be investing more in this space or not and and also did a couple of my investments have taken off like the first some of the early deals with with the fund is now two years old and we now have two or three companies that are like forty x to eighty x returns not liquid yet so you know anything can happen but that's like a crazy multiple and it's like it's it's such a it's like so into my brain i knew intellectually this is how it's supposed to go supposed to do this annual angel investing thing you get this basket of companies and then you're looking for these breakouts that are gonna return this huge you know multiple twenty x thirty fifty has hundred x thousand x returns and then when you start to see it actually happen you take out the calculator app and you're like wow this is incredible hundred thousand dollars can turn into ten million just like that and hundred thousand dollars could turn into fifty million if it does one more like leap here and that's pretty exciting so so that that's just been a like i don't know for some reason that's been a i don't like a second wind in terms of like once things i i guess in general when things become real things always ratchet up i have always felt this way like the first time i took a dividend out of my business i was like oh okay i was i thought i was already like you know all in but like this made it even more real and exciting and i'm ratchet it up when i thought i was already ratchet it all the way and the same thing's happening with the start of investing stuff were now as these startups actually break out it's like you ratchet up even more even though you thought you already work but that that tangible hit of success same thing happened with content creation i thought i was already trying and then oh now we're getting a hundred thousand plus per episode okay i'm start doing research i'll start doing more like that i was like i thought i was already doing research but no now i wanna push the envelope further alright well let's do a whole thing on vr on monday and we'll talk about your investments cool we should actually do a thing where we portfolio yeah i we can balance it we could be like okay i lost this much money in the stock market and it we can do a more wholesome like a more holistic thing so it's not just hey here's are some wins it's like i mean have to log in and look though i even fuck that never right