Fitness Hotels, Steel-Manning, and Why the Creator Economy is Overhyped

solving for demand problems suck solving for technology problems rise so we have two things going on the first is we had a have a new new intro philosophy have ever have i've ever watched a peloton a peloton class yeah they're always they always do this thing i don't even do peloton but i've seen two or three i'm gonna say always it's always like alright everybody they like come in like they were just having the best inside joke with somebody they're like okay you're gonna stop gonna start what's up everybody j all here and we are gonna rock it's like they always start with this laughter to make you feel like we were having such a good time you're in a good place right now okay well everyone we've i'm alright so here's the deal we've got a two things happening the first is last month we did a contest where people reviewed us and we gave out a thousand dollars or do be a five thousand dollars spend six thousand thousand dollars to six different people oh wow so six p one okay so six people one a thousand dollars we even gave it to like two or three people who gave us negative reviews we're gonna if you're watching on youtube you can click the link and you're gonna go the end of this episode and that's where you'll see who the names are and you have to contact ben if you're that person is that right way the people commenting on youtube get a bigger prize which is that me and you go and we reply to everybody who comments on the youtube channel personally the talk shit yeah especially if they talk shit but i like the people there's really two that i like there's the great when they say great episode i don't know what the hell they'll say back so i just say like yeah thanks but if they talk shit or if they reference some inside joke or call us out on one of our like manner or something we always say that's stupid or whatever those are great it makes me uncomfortable when that happens i get self conscious i was just gonna say to summarize yes correct we announced them at the end of a different episode we announced the winners so we're going to link to that clip at in the show notes of this episode so click there listen see if you were one of the winners if so email me and i will get you your thousand dollars and what's your what's your email ben b wilson at hubspot dot com is my alright now the second thing this is actually significantly cooler so we are giving away five thousand dollars to two fans and here's what you have to do you've gotta take our content whether it's like audio or a video which they're all on youtube and you have to remix it so basically chop it up into little viral clips and then use the hashtag m m clips so m f m clips and use that hashtag on all the popular social media shit we'll find you and the and and we're gonna do a combination of cool stuff like cool content as well as popular content and we're gonna give away five thousand dollars to do different people who use that hashtag and use cool clips or who create cool clips i think there should be sick there's somebody who did this for the all in podcast there's just a tiktok channel somebody created called all in talk like like tiktok and they just chop up clips from from the pod and they just put it up there there's no contest but this account is just getting like hundreds of thousands of views because it's the content already good all you gotta do is just grab the best okay we're we're gonna talk for an hour you grab the best kind of like thirty second back and forth and and you turned that into a clip and they don't all hit but definitely like one per week is hitting and this account is getting so big and it's just some fan account and so that's actually what i would do is you're gonna if you just did that if you just made the tiktok account for this you just put the best best nuggets on there and just chopped it your account gonna get popular which is more valuable than whatever five we're gonna give you five fried grand great but like whoever does that like we'll just employ you and also you're gonna have a account that's yeah we we we've talked about doing this for like every month so if someone's good at this we'll just give you five thousand dollars a month baby i don't know maybe that maybe it's on the cards but so m clips that's the hashtag just you know on instagram tiktok twitter we'll see we're we're gonna follow it at all and so did i read what what you me do do that correctly it's good running the only thing you didn't say is running through from now to the end of the year so you've got about a month to to do it i have a question for you guys which is if you were betting what is the over under for how many views the top clip is gonna get i think on tiktok the top the top video we get over fifty thousand views oh i was gonna say like look i think someone will get half a million on something the right thing will go by if you just take something from the rob deer deck podcast do you take something from the gary v podcast the ty lopez podcast there's a whole bunch of those andrew wilkinson there's a whole bunch of those that are good or just one of our rants or something funny that we did you know back and forth where we're we're yelling at each other those will hit yeah i i agree alright that's that sean i got a bunch of stuff you wanna talk about you wanna you you listen to the noah c pod i listened to it yeah so i listened to it in the car it's great because i normally never listened to this part because i was there we talked about it you know it's awkward to listen back to your own voice but this was different i got to basically hear an episode of m m but just with somebody else on the other side and what'd do you think of it first before i give you my i didn't think it was that good i thought it was good but here's what i thought i thought the flow was awkward yeah and i don't know if that's just how the podcast sounds when we're on it too but there was something very start stopping about it that was kind of like awkward to listen to but the topics were great like i liked the stuff you guys talked about the this the content was great because it hit the thing that i always want which is i feel like these are just two two cool people who i would be friends with hanging out and i just got to hang with him it didn't feel like a show so like you would just be like do you have a will and he's like yeah i got you know like i have one but i don't kid so i it in my brother's kids and you're like that's so weird right like it's not even your kid and he's like yeah it's weird but like you know and then you were just talking about shit that like just shit that i don't know just dudes would talk about that that that's like oh what are you doing with your money yeah is that good yeah it's good but you know blah it wasn't like some it didn't feel like i very of the podcast so i like that it wasn't a start and stopping i think that there was either maybe a weird delay or something because it happened consistently where i would i'd say something and then it it was weird it was just like this weird delay i was like oh i'm sorry you go ahead yeah we have the opposite problem we'll we'll talk over to each other but that actually makes it flow a little faster because it's just like whatever i'm talking over you you're talking over me let's just keep it going back and forth rather than what okay you go now i go right and that's the problem with the zoom pods in general why in person podcast podcasts just like that extra thirty percent better is because in person you can start talking over each other but it's that's a normal thing in a conversation you can kinda interrupt each other but if you interrupt someone on zoom it's a very abrupt like it like kind of like stops the flow of everything for some reason just the way that like kind of the conference call tech works and what did you think of was peter till that was cool i liked you know some of the nuggets i don't know if they're real like does he really have a nurse black mercedes waiting outside of the building running the car must be running and the jet must be fueled and on the runway at all times the book that's what it i was quoting the book so that that was cool but i didn't know if it was real i liked the poker story where he was like he bought the booking him and then he need to go meet exactly give back an ask for his money back i know thought that was hilarious that should be a clip by the way those are the nuggets that yeah i should be clip those are the nuggets that make you like feel like you kinda get to know the psyche of somebody like we already know the we already know the resume so you don't need to talk about what peter deal done you gotta talk about what's it like like i've told the story i think told the story the not i met a guy who in college was friends with a guy who worked under peter t at paypal so peter was ceo a friend of a friend yeah friend of a friend was was the intern there at the time he's in college and the intern gets invited to go to peter's like tahoe he's going like to a a vacation or you know he's invited like twenty people or whatever to come to his cabin so the friend tags along and he gets there and he said oh by way he listens to the pod so i think he'll appreciate the story being told without giving away too much info he gets there and he goes the first question peter asked me he goes how much money do you have and he's asked that peter risk the the kid the college kid the kid is like like you know none based i have like a checking account at it was fargo like what what what what what is this question he goes no i don't care how much money you have but you should whatever you have you should invest in a company called facebook and this is back in like two thousand and five or something like the two thousand six maybe and he's like you should invest every bit of it into a company called facebook and at the time peter was the main investor facebook and the guy is like okay like the college thing like we do like the the like the app we waste time on like the the website we waste some time on like he was like okay like maybe but i'm not comfortable just investing all my money and it and i just met you so this is just like super direct and he's like every question he asked me was a very like thought provoking or reaction provoking question and that's something that i've heard from many people who have met him which is like he has pretty much zero interest in small talk he will he's looking for original thinkers so he'll ask you a question and then he'll hear you and it's sort of like if you're just saying the same shit that everybody says very heard like thinking i think it's you know the impression i get is he's he's mentally bucket you as like okay this person not gonna give me original thoughts and then if you do have original thoughts he doesn't really care what your pe agree is what your accomplishments are it's like okay you're in you're in the you're in the circle of people i wanna talk to because you have original opinions which goes back to this peter till question the famous interview question he has which is what's something you believe that few others would agree with you on and he's asking for this secret what's a secret you know what's something you think is true but others don't think it's true because any and that being one of your kind main questions will filter for people who have these unique insights i've also noticed that he does another thing that's actually pretty interesting and i think this is one of the reasons why he's hated by a lot of people so he's shockingly open minded almost to the point of like seeming stupid and like so like for example when he supported trump people were like what are you doing like that's the worst thing right and i like heard his explanation and i actually don't remember what it was but the feeling that i had was like that's logical but like my i don't like trump and my emotions feel this way so i just can't go along with it but he was very logical and what he does this think where he says if someone says like do you think drinking eight glasses of water is good for you he would say like well you know a lot of people think that it is great for you because the doctors and and research have proven that x y and z on the other hand hydration plays a role in health yes but on the other hand it's actually overrated and you should consider doing this and a lot people think that that's true and so he actually says both sides of of like when he answers a question he goes well a lot of people believe this and then other people believe this and then some people believe that and it's kind of intriguing so i heard you say that on the pod and in my head i was doing the thing listeners do what they're like oh i have something i would add to this conversation so i'm glad you brought it up because that's a technique have you ever heard this technique called steel manning no do you know what straw manning is yeah it's an example like well i can't even think about an example okay straw manning is basically when you let's say you are debating somebody something about something you're arguing about something or debating or having a conversation and you kind of pigeon hole somebody's view into like you kind of create this really weak version of their argument that you could knock it over real easily right like imagine a man made of straw you could just blow it you just blow a gust air and it would just fall over right away so it's like saying well sam i know that you you think that everybody just needs to shut their eyes and put their money into the vanguard etf no matter no matter what it's like no that's not actually my argument but if you make it sounds so if you make if you make a weak version of my argument then yeah it's gonna be really easy to contradict it and that's what most people do so that's the like what i would the common person habit is when there's something you disagree with you sort of if to present their side you present the straw man which is the absolute weakest version of that argument so you could knock it over and put your put your view in place and what the smartest people do is the opposite they do something called steel manning which is even if they disagree with something they'll they'll go into it and they'll say you know people who believe that you should do x would say and they will they'll make the strongest possible argument for that thing right deal it's almost like an in good faith way of figuring something out so the the straw man is like a bad faith way of doing it it's like i'm gonna i'm gonna kind of like cherry pick the weakest parts of your argument and present that as your full argument and i'm gonna get rid of the the the nuance or the context or whatever else and the steel man would say you know trump supporters people who who who support donald trump you know the straw man is they're just racist people who you know hey hate mexicans or whatever right like they're they're just you know whatever and the steel man version of it is you know some people are the top priorities for them are their economy especially if they live in states like ohio and you know michigan or whatever and they've been decimated for their jobs and they actually see that trump is willing to invest in their jobs and so it could actually be really great for this this and this reason although he says some things that are very like un and offensive to certain groups he really you know he's he doesn't do a good job of that but the pros that outweigh the cons that would be the reason you would support donald trump and so steel manning is this tactic that i think if you wanna be if you wanna like build yourself into a learning machine who gets smarter over time you wanna learn steel manning which is how do you understand the other person's viewpoint and actually build their argument stronger than they could build it themselves so that it doesn't mean you have to agree with it it means you have presented the strongest case on both sides and then you decide which one resonates with you which one is the the more true version or the more correct version that you should go with rather than making a unfair fight i think that's a like a legitimately life changing skill i've just learned not skill but like lesson right i'm gonna that that's one and i think peter till does that so it it's not that he says oh some people would say that this and some people will say that so i don't know it's he steel man's both sides of the argument and then he decides which one he believes is the correct one and i think that's like a really powerful thing to do that's a good one that him and other smart people i know do that's great i'm gonna start doing that i i and i i i wasn't i didn't know what that was and i don't actually know too much about logic and arguments and things like that i don't i don't understand it entirely right i don't study give you one other thing i've been observing which is people who grow up and in high school do speech and debate or in college you speech and debate i'm just noting noticing that that is a common thing amongst amongst successful people i know and there's really like i would say like three or four really common success paths that like if i look at a whole bunch of successful people that i met and i trace back down i'm like okay here's four paths that like like wow they all like this cluster of people all had that same experience growing up that's weird like the this of this group had this so i'll give you a couple of them one is speech and debate this comes but this is sort of best done with like either entrepreneurs investors of salespeople so they're able to just really effectively tell their argument actually when i did the episode with hu mina the the comedian i was like you know you're like a you're like me you're like indian kid growing up stand up comedian not usually like a career choice so like the when did you figure out you wanted to do that he's like oh he's like i went to a a chris rock show or i saw a chris rock stand up he's like as soon as i saw it he's like i was a speech and debate kid in high school and i just saw this as humor speech and debate i was like oh he has a he has a a stance that he has to take which is like you know you know women love buying things right and then it's like and then all it is is supporting arguments that ladder up to to like re support that argument at the end but the supporting arguments don't have to be like super literal they could be like humorous i said it on this podcast i think that my speech and debate class in college was the only effective class i ever took oh you were one i even know that you were speech to make it too oh my god that makes perfect sense and i can and i yeah i remember all the ones that i gave and and the really good part is when they make you argue about stuff that you don't actually like right yeah totally because it yeah that's the thing in debate you don't get to choose the thing you already believe in you're assigned it's like you're gonna argue for this thing whether you actually believe it or not so you have to get good at like steel manning that argument basically so okay speech and debate is one i've i've traced another one is hardcore gamers so people who get really freaking good at video games like i'm talking about like competitive or like complete obsession if channel properly that same type of person can can use the same kinda like strategy cooperation grinding mindset like ability to understand the rules of the game and then find the shortcuts find the hacks in the game find the glitches of the game to get in you know the infinite money hack basically so i know a whole bunch of people that got super successful in crypto they all came from like this rune scape mafia it's basically a bunch of dudes used to go in this game called rune scape and they were trading in the arena basically they're like buy sell they would they'd go farm and get some virtual goods and they'd would go flip them and they were basically digital flipper and like i guess what that same group of people is really fucking good at crypto and was early on at figured it out early they were good at poker they're like that same skill set applies to a whole bunch of things that can be successful so hardware gaming is another one this there's an obsession and a strategy component to it that i think plays well later and these are ironic because that's one your parents if they saw you doing they'd be like what a waste of time why you just why are you wasting your time playing video games go learn something useful who in actuality the skills you build gaming are so applicable later i think that there was a time recently where i figured forget exactly what it was but someone was trying to solve a not a math problem but some type of like code where you had like sequence dna something i figured get get exactly what it was where you had to do like a series of incredibly hard problems in order to solve something very important and no one could figure it out and then this like medical board put it out for gamers and turned it into a game and they solved it in like a month or something like that no way yeah that's amazing yeah like we both invested in synthesis school which is basically teaching kids through games it's the it's a rip off of when elon musk was at spacex he designed a school for his own kids to go to and they called it add astro which is like to the stars and it was a school insides of spacex the only the rocket scientist kids basically could go to and elon kids would go to it and then they basically spun that out and and the sorry the the premise of the school was kids will learn more when they're having fun and they're engaged nothing is more fun and more engaging to a kid than a game and when they start to play the game they will start to learn all this necessary skills strategies and tactics to win that game and so like so they they spun that out as synthesis school now it's available to anybody and so people are you know doing it mix few million dollars a year of recurring revenue of tuition base of people sending their kids there and the entrance the application to apply to the school is this game and i played it i couldn't even beat the game i couldn't even beat the game that basically a eight year old is supposed to beat in order to get into the like candidate pool for synthesis it's like all it does there's no instructions it's u versus a computer there's dots on a screen and you make a move and the computer makes a move you make a move computer makes a move and then eventually the computer wins and you're like oh okay so you're supposed to get to the green dot okay that's how the computer alright now i'm gonna try to get the green dot how do i be oh i see the computer can move diagonal let me try doing that and it's this trial and error figuring out process that like your brain is just fully locked in by the way it's called there was basically like an aids like virus and scientists for a decade or two couldn't figure out the structure of a protein cutting enzyme and they sit set it out to gamers and they figured it out in three weeks yeah all of world's problems like you know peace in the middle east all it requires is a video game if we need we wanna pull it off just give it to the gamers even even ethereum by the way i don't know if know the founding story of ethereum but the guy who made it this guy metallic who's this like you know ultra nerd looking guy hayley super nerd alien looking guy brilliant guy like if you read his blog post so thoughtful so brilliant like next zuckerberg next bill gates type vibes for sure he actually credits that he was a he was a hardcore world of warcraft player he was grinding like crazy he got to level sixty which is the max at the time and he had like leveled up his character and earned all this stuff and then the game maker changed the rules of the game where they like changed the way the items worked and like some of his character items like that he had worked so hard for it got take it away and he was like so he was just like for three weeks he was like inc incompatible he was like just so upset he couldn't believe it and he found it so unjust that the game maker could just like he didn't own his items that the game maker own the items it could just change the rules on or and rose pull them at the last second and ethereum is basically this global computer where the users own their own do you own your own tokens your own your own items you have your own private keys then there's no company there's no the the the the whole platform is designed so that the the app makers could never do that to you and he credits that is like a pretty major influence in his thinking and like sent him down a rabbit hole of like why is the world the way it is and how can i change it i never heard that stories so what what's the what's the last one or two let last one or two so ar arbitrage so these are people you've probably met a bunch of people who are like yeah i got like gambler or you're successful now but they're like i got my start doing like you know kind like affiliate ad network online sending traffic to porn sites or like you know like yeah i realized you could just buy this t shirt you could drop t shirt and i could get this ten percent vague yeah just in the arbitrage between this ad network and this place this click and that click they just love the action they love the action they learn how to do internet marketing at a like very fundamental level and and at at some point they get sort of dissolution decision like okay at what am i doing in here just sending clicks to plenty of fish and i make you know oh seven dollars per click margin and i'm just like i what am i doing here could i apply the same skill to a brand that i create to a product i genuinely believe in to a an education app that i make whatever and they they go on to do some pretty great things so i've noticed that that's one more and there's there's there's actually a few other archetypes that i i don't wanna spend the whole episode doing it like teachers is another one i met the founder of alibaba jack mann he was a former teacher and wouldn't you meet him i met him in college there was this trip organized if there was this thing called ky which they named hundred top hundred college entrepreneurs and it was total horse shit like we applied the night before we had we weren't they didn't know anything about us and we got in because like they i went to duke and they needed a quote of a kid from duke and so they got we got into it even though we had done nothing and and just to show you how like fake the world is we got into that hundred entrepreneurs thing the event took place at the new york stock changed they had like shut down because the the guy who started his dad's like mega loaded and super powerful and bill clinton came to speak so it seemed like this ultra legit event it was not legit at all like it was like just a total party in meetup for like random college kids like the forbes thirty cnn shows up and i get on cnn and i'm i have this clip of me pitching my sushi restaurant on cnn as like the next big thing and cnn runs it as like oh college breakout success here this business is a lot of the best businesses in college right now so it's like oh if you believe cnn you would think oh this is like a great business idea that they're featuring on cnn no it just happened to be that i was just front of the camera and cnn didn't give a shit they're just recording up and put it on put in another filling airtime you know that didn't care there's no filter a quality filter and then at the end of that they were like pay you know through our connections we got the sea of alibaba to pay for all us to go because all expenses paid here to china for a week to hang out with him and see their headquarters and all that so i got to go on that with jack m with jack m and we talked to jack m and jack m tells a story and he goes people are asking wasn't what are the keys to success and he goes in china there's two successful ceo types can i guess yeah go teachers teachers is one here's was a teacher yet military it's correct okay i don't know how you knew that that was amazing am i told that story before or you guys do that it's a guess yeah he was like military you know the rigor of operations that you need in business like there's no better training for that than the the rigor of military and the systems and the timing and the production the detail oriented nature he's like so any manufacturing business in china the best leaders of best ceos are ex military and he goes for the non factory type businesses like an alibaba teachers tend to do pretty well he goes he's we said why you know that doesn't make any sense to me and he goes a teacher is one of the only professions where the success of the student matters more than the success of the teacher like they care more that they're the people under them succeed he goes in management that is you know the best principle for breeding great managers is if you were like a teacher and your success was not in how high you climb but how great your managers became and so that was his his reasoning i don't know if that was correct not sick but i thought that was outside i can't believe i've never heard that you'd tell me that story that you got to go to meet jack it's actually badass ass yeah i know there were some crazy stories there but we have some other stuff we should talk about let me tell you about something go to rock auto rock auto dot com alright i'm go on rock auto like auto like car okay yeah alright i'm on a craigslist looking ass site what the traffic this is a sample classic here so this company is called the rock auto rock auto i don't know my twenty million monthly yes okay so i was listening to an mma podcast michael biz podcast is going on and he does this ad read if he goes if you're buying car parts go to rock rock auto dot com they've got every car part you could ever want and i had never really heard of a i know toy or something like that tire sponsors a lot of like sporting events so i understand me like it's a lot of like meat head car people but i never heard of an auto parts other than like napa and the famous one and i went to this website rock auto dot com because they're sponsoring a bunch of podcast and it's the most bare bone site i've ever seen and i was trying to do a research on it and there's close to nothing out there there's a few articles from like five six seven years ago but basically started by two brothers i think in michigan they've got over a million parts and the traffic is nuts so according to similar web it's like north of twenty million and look at the source mostly all direct and so these guys this they must be something that car whatever repair shops go to order or no just customers are going no it's meant for just individuals just nerds just guys who are tinkering or if you just like wow for example something broke on my car and i just like i just need this little part i could replace it on my on my own just like a little like door handle thing and so i was like trying to figure out where to get it and they had it no way so do they own the do they like inventory themselves so they don't so what they do is they connect with dozens of or hundreds of suppliers and they just have this like intricate system of distributors all over the the the the country and they send you the part they need and their goal is to have the like one part for every car that you need so if you ever need anything for a car they can get their hands on it you know kinda like how bezos said if there's a book in existence we should sell it and that's kinda auto part and i was thinking about this for a few different reasons the first is with e com i was like what doesn't amazon crush it in and they don't crush it in hardware so like home depot style stuff right home depot dot com is like the fourth or fifth or six something like that largest retailer in the world still and they've not gotten hurt at all with amazon really or a little bit they have but not in terms of like buying screws online and another thing is auto parts whether for cars or motorcycles and so there's this company called re who was recently acquired for like five hundred million dollars and they sold motorcycle gear motorcycle parts and then i was looking at rock auto and then i was looking at a bunch more and it's incredibly fascinating because there's not that many new people in this space but it seems like a pretty huge space you know morgan stanley had this report and they said like it's a seventy billion dollar year industry by the i just looked up the ceo of rock auto he looks like jeff bezos before bezos got ripped yeah it's like it looks like for c h bezos yeah it looks like the before photo of jeff bezos yeah and it's amazing i think it's interesting i've always thought the space because i i something broke my car like i said and i tried to like figure out how to buy the part and it it's a pain it's a it's it's a pain but the problem with this is is that you'd have to have so many skews i mean yeah like i'm looking at let like bmw like i have bmw x five bmw x five or or i'm not even not even that if you just go to bmw it's like you can look at a car from nineteen thirty nine like okay here's the models or here's the makes in nineteen thirty nine you'd and then you could find a part for the cooling system of the nineteen thirty nine bmw blah like it's amazing right it's so hard it's a real it's a really hard problem to solve for but what's interesting is i don't think this is a demand problem which is cool solving for demand problem suck solving for technology problems rocks if you could figure out how to build a mouse trap that's far better than figuring out like are my seem gonna go into this thing right you know what i mean anyway so that's why you you wanna be supply constrained not demand constrained when you yes when you do something and this it's just incredibly interesting to me and i think in order to get popular on this you just would crush seo you and and and and that's how you'd have to do it and i think that you could do it by sponsoring a lot of youtubers and things like that and it's just an interesting business that i don't think has has has taken off like or an an interesting industry i know amazon's thought about going into that space but what pretty fast is worth i bet you rock auto i was looking online trying to like triangulate some of their stuff and i found some old interviews but if they i i would think they have to do at least a hundred million in sales and i don't think they other than recent podcast podcasts stuff if i if i bet you they don't spend any money on marketing other than like sponsoring like maybe like some car shows wow unbelievable that's crazy right that's a good fine grapevine fine grapevine fine gotta huge props on that one that's go to their similar web and look at if you look at where the traffic is coming from virtually one hundred percent practically all of it is coming from search and direct so people typing in rock dot com amazing what else you got what's this hotel thing you got okay i'm gonna start a hotel i don't know if i'm gonna do it today i'm definitely not gonna do it today but i'm gonna do it soon can and let me explain what i'm gonna do okay so there are i i went and met with some like olympia beans the other day this guy who is this olympia dm me he's a runner he heard that i liked running and he asked if i wanted to get dinner i went and got dinner with him and like eight of his athletes so he like was an olympia and then now has an agency and he has like forty one track field athletes not really popular for most people for me it was cool and i could like i knew who they were like a triple jumper of mile whatever and i was talking to them about money and they don't make anything like like some of them like have little airbnb on the side or they bought a car to put on toro and one of them got is an american record holder in her event another one won a gold medal and so anyway i was interested in in that because i was like man if i wanted like pay you to be my coach i bet you i could get you to do that like you can't be that expensive and i started thinking that have you heard of usc how they have the thing called the performance institute yeah they built these like kind of state of the art u sees gyms where the athletes can go train but i think it's also kind of a tourist not tourist destination but it's like a there's a public facing component here right like you can i don't think there is because when heard about this but when i've heard about this i'm like i wanna go there i wanna work out there i would do they have a hotel i would love to stay there and i think so i think i can create a hotel or a piece of like a a large piece of property and here's how i'm gonna test it so in this order here's what i'm gonna do i think i could figure out is is their demand for this and the way that i could do it is i can get a bunch of these olympia beans or the idea first is is it a man for this this being what it's just a general tell us i i think i could create like a resort like a where you go to just to train and work out with competitive athletes okay so and i think i can convince the competitive athletes to live there for most of the year as like a training place and they do a camp in the morning and train for the rest of the day and get paid to do that gotcha okay i think i could solve that and the way that i was try and solve for that is i'm am gonna con attacked like a really nice hotel i'm gonna explain to them what i'm doing then i'm gonna contact some of these athletes and i'm like hey i'm gonna pay you this much money i'm gonna charge these people a hotel fee plus a fee on top of that and i'm gonna give you a cut the money and i think i can host an event at some of these places and and and make it work so my brother law who's been on the pod before brother aaron for the og listeners that remember him he loves ji and he loves any combat sports he loves training boxing he loves training movie thai he loves training ji ji too and he wanted to create this thing so he's created this thing called bali fight club and what he's doing is he almost exactly what you're talking about so he's like alright i need to create like an mma style vacation so he's like basically a lot of people are interested in like going into bali being on a beach had going to wake a resort he's like so hey he used to live near bali so he's like oh i know like i know the perfect spot for this where there's a bunch of little villas and the villas are like just dope like you're you're on the most beautiful beach you're in a cheap private villa there's like a chef that's like cooking for everybody and all that stuff and each family gets their own villa or each like kinda like resident would get their own or you can buddy up or whatever and so there's all these little little hats little villas and he's right on the beach and then he's like do the best kinda like trainers in the world for for combat sports are often in thailand he's like i'm gonna get so he met a pro boxer or when he was on vacation in mexico and the guy's like okay i'm in and so he he says like a pro boxer approach guy and a prom thai guy and they're gonna come on the trip too and they want a vacation also and they're basically like yeah we'll train the the people and they're like you get to train like an athlete trains we're gonna do two days you're gonna have a massage in between to like kind of recover the body so we're gonna treat you like you're gonna get to train like a pro athlete trains while also being on vacation and the whole thing is like whatever like five grand or something like that five six grand and this is live this is what he's creating right now so he's basically he's not like two people but he's just wait until he gets like eight people and when there's eight people like the trip will happen and so so that's what he's doing which is very similar to your idea but instead of being a hotel it's more like a getaway like a like a like a i would do a get i would do getaway at i would do getaway at first and then eventually i would acquire a a piece of property within an hour of a major international airport right do you do in the us yeah like i think you could do it in austin probably because austin is becoming like a mini center of like health nerds right i think that you could maybe do it in the california you for sure could do it in like a boulder or florida somewhere we're in florida yeah i think you could amazing yeah i think it's a cool idea i think it's sick especially because the get the getaway is a great mvp for something like that right build up yeah that's not hard to do so yeah i feel like that's that's pretty great let me tell you one more thing go to manuals so it's called like manuals like a like a like a owner's manual manuals l l i b like library manuals l dot com the ultimate manual library so it's a website that's just full of manuals okay but get that this is great like i was building i'm assembling something i don't have the manual i need to fix something out of the manual it's just here it's like here's my kitchen aid i yes this website according to their about page so the way that you find out if a business is interesting is you if you they make money through advertising you scroll down and you click advertise with us and you find out about them yeah they according to their media kit they get at least sixteen million monthly unique of which ninety percent nearly is from search okay they've got a brown three point eight million products on there with five point two million manuals a hundred and six thousand brands and three point two terabytes of data indexed hilarious do they just have every manual they scan it they like seo the shit out of there like rankings for when people it it's more interesting it gets more interesting i i was researching this i cannot find anyone on linkedin anyone online who mentions these guys or works there i can't find a thing about it i've looked all over the the i found one person who on their linkedin says that they were a freelancer and they're based out of europe that's like pretty much all i saw their main competitor is gets this is where it gets interesting their main competitor is this company called owner iq and they own this website called manuals online dot com and owner iq it's kind of a weird business but but basically they if you're gonna buy something i don't know how they do it but it's kinda like tech target that's another publicly traded company that does it they they they sell data to retail stores or brands that somehow helps them figure out who's buying their stuff and they i don't actually don't know what they do with it but owner iq owns manuals online and they do well over a hundred million in revenue and own and and manuals online is one of their products is that nutty this is wild also if you look at their like traffic you know like they really grew starting like twenty twelve they like shot up the ranks into becoming like one of the top sites now so it's definitely it was created twenty twelve and it just like pretty instantaneously like within the year became a ultra popular ultra popular site the yeah these types of business print money now this was a ad based business so i guess they're trying to get you to like i'm looking for a manual and i'm like manual for the thing i bought and i'm like fuck i'm gonna buy something else because they i don't wanna deal with this i kinda what's there's this company there's this company called tech target and they're publicly traded their market cap is ship but they still do like nine figures in revenue it's called tech target and i believe if i'm not mistaken tech target owns like websites like cfo dot com and a bunch of other websites where if you are a buyer if you so they own security docs dot com they own tech guide dot com they own things like that and so basically if you're the cfo of a five thousand person company and you are the decision maker for buying like this is like an overs vacation but like you're gonna say our company now needs to use quickbooks instead of this other software that's a ten million dollar a year product that we're gonna have to purchase and so this company called tech target will create cfo dot com and create news just hoping that the cfo will read it when deciding between quickbooks and this other website and they'll figure that out and capture their email and contact information and sell it to quickbooks and then all their competitors right so basically it's rooted in influencing what you buy yeah that would make sense to me i don't know what the manual one would because that assumes you've already bought the thing so i guess that's a little bit different but yeah these are these are great little like kind of secret jam businesses that or you know like when andrew wilkinson came on we asked them you know what type of business do you wanna buy high growth high profits and he said i wanna buy a new zealand business which is a business that is just independent sustainable does not rely on like one you know like facebook ads or some like some paid channel to like to grow that could change in a minute it's not gonna be competed against by google and facebook and amazon they'll never care to compete against this and that's a new zealand business that he can you safely buy these are to me in new zealand businesses that you you identified two new zealand businesses here yeah they're neat i i i think they're cool i think that like tech target that i mentioned they're based out of newton massachusetts this other one rock auto i think that they're in sorry they're in madison wisconsin so over the university of wisconsin is and then manuals live they're like in croatia i can't find a thing about them i can't find i feel like there's there's a business you can create okay we're still say you wanted to create something like this i think you could you'd have to look at it okay what's new what what's a new thing where you need manual so maybe there's some new prod new types of products that are out there that that needs something like this like for example it could be software things like that but software is not not new enough the other one you could do is any professional search so like well it's something that only dentists are gonna search for that's like really obscure but really important to them maybe it's around you know certain tools or the software that they use or like you know manuals for the equipment that they bought maybe it's you know treatment or like prescriptions or something like that and some people have tried to create like a separate google for doctors because doctors google the shit out of stuff but like you know i think that's really hard one another the other way the easier way but less valuable is you figure out how to rank at the top for everything that a doctor would search for and you just become the definitive authority in some profession whether it's car mechanics or dentist or doctors or insurance agents or whatever real estate agents something that they have a lot of searches for that's not like already nobody's created the the definitive central repository of information for it that's a perfect segue for what i'm about to say now listen to this speaking of dentists that's not even a segue away i'm adding to it and i was reading this article about the top creators on youtube this year number three for the most popular creator of youtube shorts is called dental digest and it's a kid who makes here's this description of his thing satisfying dental reviews dental education and dental lifestyle content this kid's got six point one million subscribers on youtube only doing dentist stuff is that ridiculous wow i'm looking at one of his right now so and it i think it says what did he say like we are like i'm a third year dental student his about yeah his about is third your dental student help wants to help you discover your best smile it's satisfying dental reviews dental education and dental lifestyle content how do we do that he's represented by night media which is the the guy read who we had on who he camera podcast and he represents mister beast also amazing right the the designer toothbrush from france eight million views dude number six on this list is also a dentist dude what's going on it must be that dental content is just interesting for non dentist that's the only explanation for this because like how many dentists start they're not even eight million dead know but this guy the dental gi guy is that i don't think he's doing like popping videos where you like watch someone pull a tooth i think he's like he's reviewing products reviewing yeah he's doing stuff that is not anyway it's kind of interesting so i don't know where we go with this but it was so weird i just watched a video was so weird it's weird right the world's funny i'm sure there's so much opportunity out there we've just identified dentist manuals auto part we've talked about so much stuff just a a short amount of time what do you wanna do let's wrap it up i have some other ideas but let's save those for the next pod let's wrap it up with one other topic which one you wanna do you tell me you pick do i don't care let's do okay i'm not really ready to talk about this okay i'll talk about this okay so here's actually i wanna hear you talk about this let's do this work week slash creator economy we never really got to talk about that so i saw that adam adam ryan i think it's his the name he used to be president of the hustle something like that like you like yeah i let our sales team he works leading sales so he worked for he was kinda like your number two guy basically at the hustle for a period of time and he had left he went and did couple things i don't know exactly he was like like competitor or something like re recourse or rec recount i don't remember yeah so he did some education thing i i don't know what happened i guess he left that or it didn't work out or something like that so he is came out with a new company recently and it's called work week and so like describe give people like this simple description of what it is and then i wanna hear your opinion on it i don't entirely understand what's the url work week dot com dot com or dot com i think it's dot com i think they got a nice domain there work dot com work dot com and so it looks like so it says work dot com it says what's their i'll read about it it says a new kind of media company it's creating a media company it says you wanna follow people not institution so i think what he's doing is there's a bunch of creators that have their own me like maybe this dentist guy would have been a fit so it's like some guy named jared d who's doing the health care huddle which would be like i don't know was it like a sub stack or something like that it's like a stack podcast a cold yeah and it's all about health so he's like he's covering the vertical of of health care there's nicole who's covering the vertical of fintech there's guy matthew who's covering the vertical of cannabis and i think they were already creating content so they were already content creators he kinda like a scouting them and saying okay they have a good newsletter let's say and he's like kind of like bringing them all under one umbrella i think he gets the rights to their content and in exchange for distribution and money is kinda of my guess the website's is very nice i i like the design of the website very much but this idea is kinda interesting to me and you're you're my go to on the media side i know you you like you like adam and you're not gonna like you know say this is a terrible idea or you know also tell you know just it's a great idea if you don't believe so i wanna know what is your honest opinion of this idea because you know media better than anyone the way okay a few things the way that it's positioned now it looks like it's just an ad agency which in itself isn't like horrible like we represent these creators yes right i think the heart part here is that the creators that they represent are nobody's like maybe there'll be somebody's one day right but at the moment this cannabis health yeah i've never heard of any of these people the yeah the cannabis thing it looks like the the guy dm me one time he had like two thousand subscribers like the health care guy has five hundred followers on twitter so not not a huge yeah and and so i think the problem i mean it's not really a problem you're just building an ad agency i think but in in work week's case it's kind of a challenge because you don't have any ad inventory to sell yeah you do so that i think it's gonna be really hard i think it's gonna be a very hard business i would never raise money for this i think it could be a really cool business that potentially like makes money but from a creator point of view i have a few perspectives first of all i i don't love the language a new kind of media company it it's it doesn't it's anyone who possesses the best the that's basically a big mistake which is positioning yourself only to other media people yeah yeah and like they don't care they're not your customer anyways right like that's not who you want i guess this is the landing page for a creator it's just jargon is what it is but whatever that's an that's a mistake that's easily fixed the from a creator point of view i think a few things one i think this whole creator economy thing is incredibly over hyped i think that the vast majority of people who are gonna be able to make a living from this is is okay let's small let's do the steel mining thing so it's so when you say career economy is over hyped that means something different to everybody because everybody has their own perspective of like is my opinion overhead well how do i know so tell me what are people saying hang about the creator economy that you think is incorrect so people are saying that the creator economy is this like new economy everything's new that now anyone with the voice can make a living and that's what that's i don't trauma manning you use trauma man you you gave them a user voice while you said they're argument which is hilarious so they said anyone okay i'm gonna try it and actually do it the right way a lot of people think that like the creator economy it means that a variety of different people more than ever before i can create stuff that seen by by people and they can make a living right that is true in that there are more than ever before but the ratio of people that are gonna succeed is still really small and i think it should be small only the best should survive and the best likely don't necessarily need you or at least they wouldn't be silly enough to sell you their ip or their content you know no one would be crazy enough to do that you know that it's the whole reason why call our daddy bail and started their own thing and so it's kinda like a paradox in that the ones that you can acquire you don't want to acquire right and the ones that you want you cannot acquire because they're too savvy or you acquire them right you did it all right you bet on them early they did in fact did they bail and then when they blow up they're like i'm gonna leave and you're like but i bet everything on this creator this is a personality and when they leave i have no recourse i have no leverage exactly it's just like the there's a reason why none of the what's that thing called that was on twitch and on youtube what's it called it was called an mc and a multi channel network said one big one called maker's studio i think that's what that's the one you're referring yeah and it actually had a big exit i think yeah they they they kinda like luck i wouldn't oh yeah luck is a little disparity but like the business kinda wasn't working but they had a they got a fantastic exit to disney and then you know and the business fell part good for them yeah right so they timed it well where disney bought it before the truth actually came out but i think what the truth is now is that maybe these things can work but likely it's gonna be needlessly hard yeah the same thing happened on twitch ninja became the number one gaming star in the world when fortnite became that one game in the world and ninja got picked up by red bull and ninja was getting paid millions of dollars every single month by both fans as well as advertisers the guy was bank making thirty million dollars a year and this team that had bet on him lu they were basically like they acquired his rights to the commercial rights to his channel it's all under contract how much do they spend you know earl they didn't spend much right because he had not he would had no following at the time so it's kinda like you know adam going and acquiring health care hud at five hundred followers he you know pick up pick up the option on the cheap you say this guy's really talented he could become something someday so lu velocity had him under contract but he was like yeah hey lu i'm not sharing any revenue with you and the this is my fictional account of what happened but they're like but but but the contract he's like yeah i just i i don't think that's fair if you wanna go try to enforce this you can but you know i will basically drag you through the mud as like trying to bring me down which is like the worst thing you can do for acquiring new players is have everybody know that ninja is so unhappy with you and does not wanna deal with you and ninja feels like you screwed him and so lu say they said to sit quiet and shut up and just like take the l so they you know they weren't getting paid the full amount or whatever i don't know all the details but like they they weren't sharing the revenue that they should have shared they still got to kinda be branded on you know be associated with this brand but they they they didn't get the upside of their great bet and then loaded was this talent agency said ninja goes was loaded and loaded as like workweek week and they had all the stars they had all the top streamers on their thing and sure enough ninja starts getting a deal with samsung and now these deals are getting big and he's getting equity deals and this mouse peripheral company accessories company and guess what ninja is not with loaded anymore right because why do i need loaded like i can do this on my own they're taking too much and you know same thing happened with doctor disrespect he goes and leaves for a different agency that's gonna take less you know like you're it's a race to the bottom as i say where you're competing with everybody wants these stars to be in there like roster and the next guy will do it for less because hey if i can get the top star like that's just good for me even if i even if they're a loss leader even if i don't make money off them and so the talent basically has end up the lu and so lu and the esports team still exist they just you know they they didn't get the it's like the whole thing was based on we're gonna acquire this talent we're gonna train them we're gonna promote them we're gonna cross promote all the players with each other and we're gonna build stars and we're gonna have this like portfolio of stars that like bringing in all this money but like that basically got like torpedo and anybody who smart knows this now there might still be one or two teams that the team brand name is like the yankee where it ends up becoming valuable like i think phase clan is trying to go public in a back right now which is like crazy to me and you know they had the same thing the number one streamer they had this guy t fu he was like let me out my contract i don't wanna be with you guys anymore because he was getting great money he's like why am i him twenty thirty forty percent to these guys i don't wanna do that and so he's like let me out and they're like no and he's like let me out and he's like free t became like the big thing the fans are always gonna be on the side of the personality that they fell in love with they're never gonna be on the side of the team and it's what's going on in the nba right now so this business i think i think like can can these types of businesses work yes but if you it depends what your goals are if you wanna start like a tech company or like a vc thing like maybe i wouldn't go this route because i think it'd be it's gonna be a huge headache that doesn't mean it can't work but i also think that one of my biggest fears is starting something in the prime of my youth when i have the most amount of energy which is for most people in their thirties at forties they have a lot of energy they've got some wisdom and they still got some time to create something and you go down this path and you look back after toil for five years and you go shit that i i we should have done this other thing right and i think there are potentially other opportunities that are even similar to this in that space where i hope that pivot can be made otherwise that that five year looking back is likely gonna happen that's the point there's like a graph that's like like energy starts at this high in your twenties and just go sort of like down over time which is like energy which is like not just like your actual energy but the amount of time you can amount of your energy you're gonna get to put towards your work so like you know you got married you know you you're gonna you gonna ship a little bit less time you have kids less time you have like you know let's say other responsibilities come up in your life or you just see you're you're more you get more fatigued you know when i was in my twenties i used to work fifteen hours a day that wasn't i wasn't super productive but i was throwing fifteen hours a day at the problem i remember i slept in the office two hundred nights one year when i was like twenty four years five and so that was like max energy now i work on average five hours a day and like so energy goes down but then wisdom goes up judgment goes up skill goes up and so in your thirties the lines like cross it's like the highest energy you're gonna have while you have some good wisdom and judgment and then in your forties your wisdom judgment goes up but your energy goes down and it's like you know not the peak anymore that's at least my my opinion of it yeah and my point with that is we're are in this crazy world at the moment where if you wanna work in the creator space there's a few routes that people go a lot of people are creating like little pieces of software that they hope to sell for five ten fifteen dollars a month right like two creators yeah yeah we're two creators and i'm like i don't i wouldn't do that i think that those businesses nine out of ten times are gonna fail ninety nine percent of time they're gonna fail know you look at the difference between a buffer which is like a five dollar twitter sharing tool it did good or it's doing a i mean it did well but it like plateau versus like a hubspot or a hoo suite that like scaled way beyond that because they sold the same thing but this is we're using right now riverside we use this thing to record this you know they charge whatever i don't nine or twenty dollars a month or something like that to random mass podcast like us and you know they're hoping to be yeah you know it's hard to imagine a world where a business like this gets to like fifty million in revenue right yes it's very hard and and and so i think of creators and i think of that space and i'm like man that's gonna be really hard like have some people done it yeah mailchimp did it but like there's way less like it's really challenging and another way you could go is like do this like add route and like that could be cool as long as you don't wanna hire a lot of people you just wanna make a lot of profit early on but if i was in this i would totally look at the markets and the markets are like all about this dow shit if you like use the word dow and web three in your memo or your deck like you're gonna raise money right like it's pretty crazy it's all it's just and so i'm just like just go over the go it's far easier to to chase the market or just getting the mix than it is to maybe do what you like strictly are passionate about this brings me to one thought that's been roll rolling in my head and i didn't wanna bring it up because it's like what does this have to do with anything but you actually kind of tied it in at nicely which is there's a certain luck with your tie with the timing of free agency so i thought about this with basketball because this funny thing happened in basketball where every year the like salary cap changes it goes was up or down based on how much revenues be made and then like every seven years they like renegotiate the overall deal between players and owners and so like there was a time and then like kind of ninety late nineties or whatever where players could there was like they could just get these huge like two hundred something million dollar contracts seven year or eight year there was no like limit to the number of years and then owners scott wise that in the next negotiation they're like hey like this guy used to be good and you're one of the contract by your eight he was totally washed up and i'm still paying them fifty million dollars so like let's make the maximum length of the contract five years and the player like okay so like basically whenever you become a free agent which as a player your time to negotiate your deal like it really matt like magic johnson back of the day i think he signed a deal where he he had a twenty year deal where he made one million dollars flat per year what and like it was like at the time it was the fat contract because he was magic johnson but like what magic johnson made was nothing he was making one million a year a scrub today and the nba will make more than one million a year so just the timing of like barely over the minimum what's the minimum half of like yeah like something like that like five hundred six hundred thousand and so you know magic johnson just by being in the eighties which wasn't that long ago like missed out on hundreds of millions of dollars probably a billion dollars total like a star like that with off court endorsements would end up making a billion dollars over their career so you know that's just like luck of timing okay well there's also a luck of timing in when it comes to business not just in like oh i gotta time the market like oh you know let's say the market's going good and my company got acquired because everybody felt all the acquire were flushed with cash versus a recession not even that what i'm actually talking about is like as an entrepreneur the like the random time when you free up like you quit your job or your company gets acquired or like whatever that thing was there's so much luck involved in like what's going on in that moment totally i absolutely we have a friend sue who came on was episode one of the podcast podcasts and he says a story which is like you i was at microsoft i quit my job i went home just to my family's house in florida and i was just kinda like okay well what the hell am gonna do now and so he didn't have a grand plan but he had is what the hell am i gonna do now moment at the same exact day that the facebook launched its app platform so he's like i'll nothing facebook launched his app platform i was like i'm wanna build a facebook app now whereas if he was just still employed or had a different idea six months earlier and he would have been in the middle of that he would have never built that app which have never led to him come to silicon valley getting acquired and getting his first million dollars and then that turned into so much more and like it's not to say all of his successes luck obviously he did a lot of good things but there is some luck of just when you're free and like what's going on in the market like where are the waves happening like right now we're doing i'm doing all this stuff like i had this e commerce company if i didn't have this e commerce company i would have been all in on web i have been investing more building more maybe we've started a company in that space because i would have been free to do that at a time when that's the obvious fucking thing to do right now is go work on web three invest in web three and build and web three or ai or whatever there's are two or three things going on right now where it's like that's the that's definitely the thing to do but if you're occupied you can't do it and so and that's that's a little bit of my point which is i i think that i think that if you create a restaurant that's really good and like momo or milk bar like momo fu or like that cake like it's not particularly like it's not really different it maybe is slightly better but whatever he he made it work and he's became incredibly wealthy that guy david chang and it's a cool gig whatever it's awesome that will work in the nineteen twenties as well as the two thousand twenties so you could pull shit off no matter what there's some stuff that you can just make work and if you just give enough time you'll make that work but then there's other things where it's like there's this tidal wave coming and if you just catch the wave even if you're shitty it's gonna be awesome right i think michael act smith this his name the guy who started calm he told me that he was like i felt like he's was like i didn't know anything about meditation but i was just able to talk to a couple people and i felt like there's this huge wave coming and if i could just paddle just a little bit and catch that wave success is gonna be incredibly easy right and he told me that and i was like oh that's so you're you're totally right if you just catch the right thing at the right time and it just seems to be the right thing at the right the right time but kind of around the right time and kind of the right thing it happened with us if the hustle newsletters we our newsletters weren't this like tied wave of a business you know our exit wasn't like a twenty billion dollar at like but it was like a nice like oh it just so happened that we caught this little trend at the right ish time well there's a i think most people would get some of the like so so the one part of what you said which is just like oh this market's ready to because like the market is ready so it's like market timing i think everybody kinda gets market timing oh that's a thing it's important but it seems very external it's like oh i can't control that and it's like you hope you get it and sometimes you don't you try to look out for it but you never know what i'm talking about is even the one thing you can get which is your own personal availability timing and so i think this has two things one is like should recognize that if there's a if there's a like wave going on and you're you're occupied with something that's not ideal like get the fuck out of there because you just needed to be free right now it doesn't even matter what you go do in that space you don't even need the idea you just need to be available you need to be single when all the you know when all the the the eligible bachelors are are walking down the street if you're not single if you're not on the street because that's the that's when the parade was going on you're not gonna get you're not gonna get picked up and so it's like being available at a certain time is really really important and also that what that means is don't pick up a mediocre project that's gonna occupy you because you just think oh well yeah i think this can't hurt i'll make some good money like i'll meet some people it's like well it will hurt in this silent invisible way which is you're gonna become occupied and that we're longer in the market for good luck to happen to you and that lack of focus is more likely than not what ruins most everyone who tries to do anything interesting i tweeted out this thing to like get to do a little research i i i kinda fucked up i tweeted it out hey what what is the biggest problem in your work life right now like i don't care if you're mega successful or if you're just like a mcdonald's like employee whatever doesn't matter who you are everybody's got like some career challenge that's on their plate right now what's yours and i said dm me and so i got a bunch of dms i forgot how much get i what i should've said is i'm not gonna help everybody because that that wasn't my fault i actually wanted to do i wanted to know what problems you're glad so i could make content that like baby speed like if i know anything about one of these problems great that i could put it out there if that's a common problem people have and so i comment because some people i i didn't think would be comfortable saying like the issue like what they're struggling with get i at least a hundred i don't know a hundred two hundred or something like that it was a lot and and one of the most common ones was like you know either some variation of i don't know what i wanna do with my life but i know this ain't it or i kinda know what i wanna do but i'm afraid to go do it like i'm doing this other thing right now and the answer to both of them is sort of the same which is whether you know what you wanna do if you don't if you know this is not what you wanna do the veil the first step is make yourself single get out of the bad relationship right like that is the the app because it is taking up space in a way that you're not your brain is not gonna like properly assess the cost of that because you're gonna just see the small benefits you're getting from it which you're not gonna see is that actually you know you nothing can fit in here because that's there i don't care if you're at microsoft or wherever and so that was like the number one and number two like but to me they're the same which is i don't like what i'm doing now should i go do x or what should i go to do it doesn't really matter the answer to both is the same which is you gotta get out of x if you're if you really like care if you want this to get to that amazing level like if you're okay with it as is fine you're okay with it as is but if you want more and this ain't gonna give you more you gotta get rid of it and that's the only decision you need to make right now you don't have to make the other decision yet yeah i i completely agree i think that just like you guys gotta get a swing i i told this to one swings you'll get you'll get a hit we have this guy who does for our e ecommerce he's amazing he's so good at like website optimization and he's like hey i gotta i wanna talk to you like you know you told me i can use this card one time which is like hey give me some advice so i wanna use it which is like i kinda wanna go to web like i've can't stop about web three i'm super interested it but i don't know if i'm just like following a hype train and what's gonna happen if the price is gonna crash and if it's all bubble and i don't know all these things and i got a good thing going for me and basically i ended up talking him like as i talked to him i didn't talk him out of it i just let him talk out loud to where was like blatantly me obvious that he needs to throw away a good thing to maybe working with you amazing which is me i'm one of his clients he's got a few clients he's this is doing gang buster and he's very good at it but he's sort of like un stimulated by just like e commerce at this point and he's super curious about this other thing but it's like how do i let this go this brings in money and it's like i'm good at it and i'm my brand is all my identities tied to this as like well okay there's i asked him you know like i'll i'll i'll read two bits of it because in case this like i know helps people which is i go do you only talk with your employees via text messages or slack well i meant like text format right yeah i tried to i try not to do like calls i told them how many employees do have can we do a call and i was like just type it here let's see if that works how many was this how many employees do you have there's like i don't know there's probably like twelve in the main in my main ships of like actually maybe fifteen of like between the fund and content and ecommerce fifteen people probably associated with it but that's a combination of virtual assistance all the way to like ben who's like you know the right hand man i called the shit out of ben but i just typed everybody else so okay so he he basically was like here's what i'm thinking blah i told him i go first question how much runway do you have if life if life costs you four thousand dollars a month to pay for it just make sure you have enough savings otherwise you can't really make this decision if you don't have any you have yeah he was like i have you know like six months totally liquid and i have another six to twelve months that like i could totally eat into without without feeling bad i think my when when i go whenever i talk to people i say twenty four months yeah i i just think that's a that's like that's like safe that's very safe i think you know you could do it but that's like a hundred we're talking like a hundred grand yeah but peep to save up i mean that that's what that means is wait and i think waiting is a very big cost to pay so you gotta be sure you're willing to pay the price of waiting okay so so then i said alright you presented me the three options but really there's two you said i can take out more clients and lose all my free time no do not do this you can keep your current clients and have some free time and it's a pretty safe path you can do that for six more months and then like collect more data if you're just not sure about something if you don't if you don't have conviction or you could quit what you're doing get rid of all your clients including me and go all in on it it's the risk is past most radical you should do this if you know what you wanna do and it really just comes out to that do you know what you want if so then go for it do not wait do not hedge your bets i said if you don't know what you want then do path b where you collect information but be really specific about what you're trying to learn don't just wait for waiting sake and just hope that you'll feel more ready later talk to yourself about what is it that you're actually trying to figure out and then figure that out in the next six months he's like and he said some other stuff blah blah blah and i was like and i at the end by the end of i was like you gotta ask yourself these three questions if i wasn't fit afraid of failing which which path would i pick because that's what you really wanna do then i said do you believe that if you put your mind to something you're gonna succeed at and i only asked him this because i could see he's a star he's really good at what he does so i know he is the the answer is yes if he puts his mind it he'll get good at something and then i said so if you know that if you weren't afraid of failing what would you do if you put your mind to it you could succeed you believe that correct yes okay then what should you do and he's like well then the answer is obvious i should go to that thing so i ended up talking myself out of ended talking one of my star guys off of my team which kinda sucks but so it happened you know if anything else soon i like you know pun knows people get cold feet but like he knows that the answer should be now from his own like i i just asked questions there were leading questions yes but at the end of day they were questions and the answers were very obvious to him and it was like you know so why would i not do this you know it all just traced back to some version of like fear and anxiety that's great i'm which is never you only want fear and anxiety driving the car they can be in the car yeah they're a passenger but like they're they're not allowed to hold the wheel can we wrap up with one quick thing yeah do you see tyrone wood is now fighting jake paul yeah the other guy dropped out or something yeah oh crazy right what do you feel about how you feel about that so let down yeah let down as well yeah would be just the most boring fighter so that's just set so bored i'm so bored by this i wouldn't taught me for to fight of dude jake paul though i'm i i'll i'm gonna pay money to watch his stuff do you pay money to watch fights yeah i pay when i feel like it's like somebody i i really care about i want like if it's a mcgregor fight i'll pay yeah and i'll pay because hey i don't wanna hassle with like the boot leg stream like crap out at the wrong time and also i feel like i'm gonna get my money's worth whereas if it's just like two if it's somebody i don't really care about then i'll just watch clips or stream it or whatever like i'll figure out another way but i won't pay the sixty seventy eighty bucks for that what website do you use hey what are we trying to do here he's trying to nuke me allegedly you would na now do you use a good one yeah you have one that you go to all the time i'll dm you some things that i do i used to use this website called project free tv i don't think it's around anymore and i would watch all my free tv tv shows on that now apparently there's this thing called cracks dreams which is pretty good may have may have may have taken a a glance at that one yeah but i'd be the same thing i i buy a lot of them i have like it's got a z in the name streams with the z i also it's good i also i pay for youtube tv so i get a lot of stuff there and i pay for espn so i get stuff there yes so by the way you heard the story in the past about how you remember when dane cook or yeah dane cook got popular did you ever hear the story of how he got popular was it from click ka yeah do you know what he did no genius fucking distribution hack this is one of the greatest growth hacks ever when ka and lime wire and all those different like you know torrent type of downloading programs were out there when people used to download music and all that i can't believe that stuff existed he he created files that would say like chris rock stand up or it'd be like you know dave chappell or eddie murphy best stand up and it be four minutes of chris rock at eddie murphy and then the next fifty six minutes would just transition to dane cook and that's how he got famous so people wanna searching for those guys they would download the thing thinking they're getting an hour special of that guy great it would start with that he'd be like now dave cook and he would just start with a joke and like sure enough people would listen and that's how he got like his distribution shots that's how we got his name out there initially well if you think back to it like of course it didn't seem the way that this way at the time but the internet was so small that i remember like i would wait for wait for something to get released and i like new off the titles like and how many cedar were on there i knew i can get that one like i knew all about it like you do about ka online you knew which ones to download for which stuff and now looking back i totally could have been i call i i totally could have manipulated it yeah like i i wouldn't have even thought of that but maybe me today would have thought of that back there but i don't know that you even when i heard that i thought it was genius it's so genius that i'm i'm skeptical it's true but but i've heard i bet you that i made so much money because he made money if you were able to make money when cds were eighteen dollars that was like the the the best time in in music and comedy in that because the cds were like fifty or eighty cents or something it was a little piece of plastic right that's basically all went to zero and now it's just only live shows back then you had live shows plus the cds and stuff and then he got into movies i think he became like the most popular comedian in the world for like two years remember that movie he was in with jessica simpson i love that movie a dax shepard checkout or something like that yeah three like runs like a sam's warehouse i love that i love i used to love dave cook he's he's like dave he's fan or cold play you're like embarrassed to talk about it yeah except for me i'm like this is good music what's the problem alright that's the episode