#194 with Justin Mares - The 4 Types of Side Hustles and how to launch a $100M DTC brand

i feel like there's a world where this like let let's be conservative i feel like there's a like this is very clearly a ten million dollar a year thing that makes two million profit yeah i feel like i could rule to world i know i could be what i want to i put my all in it like a day so on a road less travel never looking back dude there's like a picture in the background that is just getting my attention so much that crooked there's like a crooked picture you see it yeah yeah there there's a whole subreddit called like i forget what it's exactly called but it's about like minor things that are just slightly soft like what were they thinking like like there's mildly interesting mildly irritating or something like that no it's called mildly period period that's what it called did you did you just get that i know about mildly interesting so yeah anyway what's going on justin do you know you know what you're getting into like you know what we're what we do yeah no i know good bet alright good so you we'll just do like a really quick intro but you you've done a bunch of stuff i've known you since two thousand and thirteen i think right yeah i think actually a little earlier when you were doing the world how how do it we both had roommate businesses and he we just became friends he moved to san you you moved to san francisco i ended up introducing him or no he met one of the girl a girl dated for a long time in the elevator on his way up to our meeting who was my coworker and so we just ran in like the circle of friends for years that's pretty good so you get the number into elevator or what was the elevator not it's only a two floor you're you're on the second floor right sam so it's not too long to it was a fast it was a fast close yeah how'd that happen tell me right yeah you it do you want me to share this happy yeah do it i don't make it hide this sweet yeah i mean we met and just girl walked into an elevator and i was like just making a joke she was i think like maybe a tiny round can try to hit a button but there are no buttons in the elevators one of those fancy ones that like you walk into and the intended send you somewhere and so i just started sort of making phone of for that and in the several story ride with like two other stops i was like hey we should hang out and then we hung out at at sam's apartment list party and shane numbers in a bed friend sense amazing okay and sam did you did you know that justin was gonna go on to do great things at the time did you spot that earlier now was he just another dude yeah well we were both scheming at we were only twenty two i think when we met that that was a while ago and he he had this roommate thing and i had a roommate and i think anyone ever start that's like there's like three things that you start right you graduate college and that like that's like one of them and so they never work out well like they're never that good so anyway by the way there's or like music discovery why is it so hard to find new music that we can solve that problem it's roommate roommate discovery is another one and then do delivery it teacher depends who and then like or like college craigslist yeah exactly local local craigslist sometimes it's to do list or sometimes if it's like your first time commuting you're like if you're i know this for engineers i've i met like ten engineers that all made the same thing first which was basically like a bus tracking software like tells them when the bus is coming because they just like you're so tired of the unpredictable like is it seven minutes more or less and they're like i need to make an after this well so yeah we are we were both doing that and i knew i mean whatever we that was the stepping stone for both of us and then he started you c wrote a book with a guy or no you you sold the company or you joined a company somehow you're working with my friend terry and their whole business was buying and selling stuff and that was like pretty successful i believe and then you also started working on running this book called traction with this duck dot go guy gabe is his name right yep exactly and then it and then he was doing u me courses and i was like yeah i mean we're all like scheme he had like airbnb and i think you did you buy cars and rent them to uber people no my my roommate was doing that i was looking at doing it but decided it was a miserable business so didn't end up doing it and we were so we were always doing stuff we had you had a unity course i probably was selling some type of information stuff and then he started this thing called kettle and fire which first of all like i thought it was so stupid on so many capacities or so many places first so first i was like he was like i gonna start like selling like this like hard good i'm like bro like we work in the internet why would you ever wanna like start like a goods thing then he was like it's gonna be food and i'm like oh your kit like why would you ever do that then he said it bone broth and i was like bone broth people drink bone broth and then this was like before like this whole like i don't even think the word d was a was a thing and so avi i mean i thought it was just dumbest thing ever and i was wrong right like it was it's been a it's been a smashing success and he started this kettle and fire thing and and it's quite big also started my neighbor sean is this guy named anthony i don't know who did it first one of you guys like had this thing called perfect keto where you're selling keto product and then you guys like combine you you so we we partnered up on it basically we i was like running kettle and fire and as i do sometimes looking for like another side hustle thing to start on the side and he had another business that was in the supplement space but the two of us were just like hey we should work on a small side project together make something that does twenty grand a month and like once we hit that threshold we'll like blow it all on a ridiculous trip to japan and that was like the whole goal of the business when it's like we it's yeah i mean we we thought it would take like a year or two to get to twenty grand a month and we did it in the first like forty five days it was insane and then kettle and fire is like a big thing too you guys like i think everything raised money or did you sell a portion of it yeah so kettle and fire we we raised money we bootstrap for the first eighteen months raised a tiny bit of money less than a million dollars ran another like sixteen months and then decided that the the opportunity was big enough that it made sense for us to raise so we raised sixteen million dollars in twenty eighteen about half of that went to secondary and the other half went to like actually putting money into the business so i've heard a number that either kettle and fire or perfect keto or both did a hundred million in revenue i don't know if that's a cumulative lifetime number i don't know if that's an annual number is this a public number or is this what what can you tell me about this because that was a big number i was surprised and i'm a customer i like six of your bone broth you know sitting in my pantry right now yeah i really like i love that there's one flavor i really like and i feel like i never get it in any store and then i'm like alright let me try these other five and see if any of them can match that one i really love what's the one that you're super into i don't remember which one is it's like the top it's like i think it's like one of the thai lime the tom yeah i think it's either the tom yum or one of the other ones like it's like this like a thai curry type flavor and yeah yeah yeah but one of my favorites yeah and some of those by the way are nasty but some of them are really good and so i'm like it's like you know those like when you get a pack cards you're like looking for a hologram like like a holographic charizard inside and then you get a squirrel that's how i feel about caleb var i know this is not common but that's just my personal experience with the with so far hey thanks ben i'll take that as the compliment okay but back back to the business side so i was a customer but i was shocked i heard that hundred million number what is that number yeah so that's not cumulative you know we we we stopped sort of disclosing revenue numbers recently but i can say in twenty nineteen like the two businesses combined at north of a hundred gotcha and is what is perfect keto so i know kettle fire what's perfect keto yeah so perfect keto is a a line of supplements and food products for people interested in lowering their carb and sugar intake and so we we have like a clean label line of foods and supplements for people on a ketogenic diet or who just like wanna eat fewer carbs and no sugars gotcha and are you keto and sean the guy who started it by or his partner is literally my next door neighbor yeah but you also say everyone's your neighbors so i never know and then i came to visit you and you drove me around you're like that's where this guy lives that's where this person lives that's where this person lives now i now i believe but some listening later like wait he said his neighbor is neville then he said his neighbor is the guy who made the ice barrel thing that we talked about last time then he said his neighbors is the the student loan guy then he said the neighbor is the southern and student the student loan hero guy and the guy the same guy they lived like he lived like twenty houses down anthony literally lived direct like like thirty feet from me right yeah yeah like literally right so the con i guess the context here is you knew justin lucy and i heard my justin todd lose you know okay and intimately and you've done two things i think that are really interesting one is the perfect keto stuff and killing fire basically building a brand that that's been pretty damn successful and then the other is you write content and i wanna actually talk about some of the content stuff you're write so you have the book traction that's a good book but on your blog there's one blog post that i remember it's been sent to me several times so i know other people like it too so let's start there if you're if you're cool with it which is you have this side hustle post on on your blog and i'm assuming this is probably one of your more popular blog posts is that right yeah definitely and you basically outline that you've done a bunch of side hustle and then you have like kinda like break it down is like there's these four types of side hustle so can you give us kinda like give us the the side hustle bit here which is like and if you scroll all the way down to that sheet you're on you'll see your your yeah which is basically like what are the side hustle you've done i kinda what how do you think about side hustle and then break people break those four down for people totally yeah so the reason that i got into this is when sam and i met you know the two of us were like we want to do this entrepreneurship thing but in in many ways it's actually a lot easier and like emotionally bear to start a company if you have just like income coming in that's covering your expenses and so when i moved to san francisco you know this the city is super expensive and so i started like doing a bunch of side hustle just to try and make income that would give me the freedom to like spend my time trying to launch a a company that would really create a lot of like equity value and sort of like life changing you know financial freedom and so when i when i did when i moved to like started airbnb being our place we have one point yeah know this is twenty thirteen we had like the number third like the third ranked airbnb in san francisco and so we were we were like renting out either our living room most nights or you know over summers we rented out for like fifteen to eighteen grand a month and then we just and we were paying three grand a month for the spot so like that was incredible at at the time and we just travel and then launched like u courses there was a period where i was buying motorcycles that were on craigslist in oakland and selling them in san francisco because there was like an arbitrage there so i was just doing a bunch of random random stuff and so when i wrote this article so many people that i've talked to were like you know i wanna understand how to make side income and how to think about this stuff and so i just kinda like broke down like the the different sorts in my mind like the four kinds of businesses that you can start as a side hustle you know some of these that i've done actually ended up being more more real businesses but like do you want me to just talk through the categories and kinda of what you also had a good disclaimer which is like look first things first except that what you're doing is not meant to be the next facebook it's not meant to be a startup it's like you're trying to make money you're trying to get some profitable cash flow from a business quickly without a ton of like you know without waiting seven years for this thing to pay off so like first let's call it what it is alright let's call a spade to spade is i i thought an important disclaimer and then you had these four four groups so let let's run through them and then sam you tell me if you've also done any in these category yeah totally yeah i mean i think truly if you're mark zuckerberg or like a call rather like fucking raise money do like the the massive thing that you're working on i just think for most people entrepreneurship is a means to an end and that end is like a lifestyle that people are trying to create so the the more that you can like create that and get in the faster you get financial freedom i just think that's a useful thing for more people to have in general so the the four like kinds of side hustle that that i've talked about in my blog post the first one that i talked about is like buying an existing asset basically you can look at like what's an existing asset that that you could try and purchase leverage your skills connections resources whatever to upgrade that you know make it more cash flow positive make it do better whatever and then you get to capture the value created by upgrading that asset i did this with like sam i'm sure you guys could do this if you bought an email newsletter you know you know how to run that better buy it for a million bucks improve it you could probably sell it for you know three to five a couple years later yeah i was my friend ramon bought something that i have i had a small part of and it was a software very small software app that when we bought it maybe it was doing twenty thousand a month and all we did was we doubled the price of the product of it doubled the revenue amazing and do you did that too didn't didn't you own a or you bought a thing called fo right yeah yeah so a partner and i bought a shopify app called fo it was doing fourteen came on for the time we bought it but you know bought it we paid less than four hundred i'll say that less than four hundred thousand and yeah which which is like a super good multiple you you did equity down right so you get seller financing or would you do yeah so we had a really like the the guy basically wanted it out it was a single founder and we were like hey we know how to market we have connections we can like really help grow this thing and so we bought eighty five percent of the business we bought it and then we are basically we're like we're gonna buy this and pay you in monthly chunks for the next twenty months and so every like month for twenty months we use the revenue that we're making from fo to make our payment to him and like my partner and i basically came out of pocket zero dollars to acquire this asset we're obviously working on running it we like had to throw i think it ended up being five grand each to pay the developers the first couple months but but yeah i mean it was like an incredible acquisition how big is it now now it does about ninety five grand a month sounds like a good deal to me yeah it's a good deal i mean it's a good deal for everyone the guy like has gotten his time back he started other companies in the interim and like when we exit this thing he'll make probably more than he would have made on the exit then you know how do he continue to run this for the last three years and with no headache it's like a nice idea so you're talking about buy so category one buying an asset this can be a house that you're airbnb it can be a internet company that you just you know you do with sam did you go on the code you push you know control f you find the price and then you change the number to double oh just like sam's genius or what you did was you you know who i learned that from was terry you're i don't know if he was your boss or what but she taught me how to go with how of how to find the price for little what well she was like she was like look the whole thing is that engineered led businesses typically are priced poorly and if you just double the price it worked right and she was like double the price and then find out which emails urls are being used a bunch of times so for example if you have like eighteen people using at uber dot com contact the hr department or whoever the procurement and like sell and like she kinda like taught me the stuff that justin's old company was doing yeah exactly so i so i ended up i really like this buy an asset thing i think sometimes you have to have money other times you can sell our finance but we ended up doing this too with an apartment building in in vegas where we bought a fourteen unit department building can put it all on airbnb basically like tripled the cash flow and then sold it eighteen months later for you know seventy percent more than what we paid by the in the blog post you had a couple examples i think are useful we're we don't have too much into but you were like you talked about this thing which is like okay if you know you have the skills to like improve the value of the assets so for airbnb you were like alright to get more airbnb bookings like no first if it's not on airbnb we should put it on airbnb if it is on we can like boost the bookings by like these three things right put more and better photos up okay easy anybody could do that but most people haven't optimized that second like instantly respond to every inquiries that we get a fast response rate the algorithm likes that and then the last thing is like whatever like five star reviews at the end or something like that and so you're like i can just take those three levers and i can apply it to any property now that isn't optimized for airbnb so if they think it's worth a hundred i already know it's worth the hundred twenty because i know i can just do that playbook again on on on a on any property yeah exactly and and that's like that actually leads to the sort of like the second bucket of side hustle that i talk about which is basically look at what is a marketplace with existing demand where you don't have to go out and find the customer you just provide the supply side stuff like buying you know putting a property on airbnb all i have to do is understand how does the property like or how does airbnb dictate where i rank you know and what does it want for me as a supplier and then my mission is gonna get booked up like i don't actually have to go find every individual customer that's traveling to san francisco that can rent our apartment because like airbnb is doing that for and you did that with like what you used have a thing it was called sequel for programmers or what was they called sql partners or yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so basically exactly so so i've done this on a couple platforms like amazon is is a big one like a bunch of people are starting fba businesses but i sort of think that focusing on up and coming platforms where the supply side isn't crazy competitive is actually a really good place to start where you could like when i when i was when i launched my first unit course you know i filmed it literally over five days in my bedroom in san francisco no like good quality no good editing it was just like it candidly like was not an amazing course from like student experience standpoint but the content was good but uni me was such an early platform that i put it up there and just by being literally the first guy to talk about here's how to learn sequel as a marketer like that course sold i think like sixty grand over the next couple years and to this day i still get like a thousand dollars a month from that course from uni which is absurd and you know that was all because like here's an emerging platform they want people creating stuff on the supply side how do i create a course or whatever that just like can reach people who already looking for something on a platform and focus on that and i don't know if you did this like that but there's ways to basically figure out what are people searching for so there's like tools like a trash or whatever you can figure out what what google searches are are are people doing and in what volume but even on individual platforms there's ways to figure it out like i know i looked at this business to buy and it was this girl selling a waste trainer you know a waste trainer is no it's basically do you know what this thing is it's like i had no idea what this was before so it's basically like you know like okay i'm gonna here's the here's the man's playing to there's three dudes talking about voice generators alright so you know like if you watch like pirates of the caribbean or some any movie or or show that's like based some kinda like olden times girls wear that like cor set it's like this super tight thing that that you're like you squeeze into this and wear your dressed on top of your figure gets like your stomach gets squeezed out and your boobs gets squeezed out banks or stuff it's it's like old school span and so what waist trainers are are that it's basically like a cinch you wear around your stomach constantly and it makes you look good in the moment but also the idea is that it trains your your muscles or your body to like to to tighten up because you kinda have to keep it flexing way for it to not like gonna be uncomfortable i guess i don't know what the theory is but as my guest like the kardashians kinda like you know talk about the stuff and it kinda got a little more popular so this girl who was building this business i was like so like do spend every month in marketing she's like like we don't spend anything in marketing like how do you how are you growing so fast she's like oh i just saw that on youtube nobody was owning the keyword for waste trainers and like how to size one how to wear one do they work since she just created like the youtube channel to be the answer to every search question about waste trainers on youtube and you can go if you go search waste trainers right now and youtube you'll find all her video amazing and so all her sales just come just from that and she's doing a few million dollars a year of of revenue a million dollars of profit per year just through that one channel alone amazing damn good for her but yeah then i i think exactly what you're talking about it's like find where people are searching for something and there's no supply there and that's a really good place to focus like when i launched sql for marketers there was literally almost nothing under the like marketing like the technical marketing or like the data analytics data driven marketing section for uni and so it was like cool if i put that up there that seems like it'll it'll resonate and do well which ended up incorrect and what are the third and fourth ones yeah so the the third one is basically like launch a unique product in an area where you can buy customers via have paid acquisition and again i think all of this is like super important to to remember that you're not billing facebook you're just like if you look at google adwords or waste trainers as you're saying and there's a gap there you can figure out how to make a product and your goal is not like make a hundred million dollar business but make one that does a million dollars a here like they're are almost infinite niches on the internet where you can just make a product buy some rough keywords and just sell through in a category that you know where where you're like the first to market or the first to do a really good job what's an exam market that's what's an example in that category that you've seen from yourself or a friend or someone you've seen recently that's doing that that model yeah so there there's a company actually that is doing that's like vests for dogs but the vests are spiky so that coyote don't attack your dog so you can dog into a plug this best yeah exactly like you could put this vest on a dog and then it won't get eaten by coyote because it's got like spikes all over it so i mean what an incredible niche product you know that's definitely not gonna like go public but that can be an incredible business and so that stuff like that i mean honestly that's what that's what ke fire was gonna be when we first launched it i had no idea that bone broth would be such a compelling category and and the trend would take off like it has like our plan was basically we looked at we looked at google searches and we're were like i think we can build a like twenty to forty grand a month business so when you say to google searches what does that mean in practical search most people have never done that so what what would it jeff fair so we we use like google adwords keyword tool just to say like which i that's that's like discontinued now yeah i know now you'd have to use a rap or some s rush or something but at at the time we used a a tool that was basically like there's two thousand people a month looking for like buy bone broth online and so if we can be the supplier that will sell you bone roth online like know assuming we convert like even ten percent of those people two hundred orders fifty hours a month like you know that that's a pretty material side hustle and so that was like the reason that we launched kettle google is like you know it's like a magic lamp and on one side you have all the aladdin out there making wishes and then you just get to be the genie so it's like there are these tools that tell you here's the wishes people are entering into this magic box they're just hoping for something and if you notice that exactly that's more people that i would have expected saying this thing or asking this question or wanting this thing and you go search for it and you're like wow these results suck okay how do i just become the top result for that thing and so you thought you thought fire would do that so give me a sense of how long did it take for you to get from idea like seeing that keyword and mean like maybe we could do this to actually make like know a thousand dollars a month i how how long was that process for you yeah so the process took about a year most of it was because i'd never done a physical product before and so it was like just bumbling around in the dark like trying to find someone that can make this stuff had a bunch of false starts but it took us basically twelve months to to go from like hey i think this is an opportunity actually having product in box but once we had product box you know we did over twenty grand our first month that we are live so and you you are you the ceo of kettle fire i am yeah you've got like three we're gonna talk about this other thing that you're thinking about doing how are you bouncing all this time it's a good question i i honestly i've never had a good answer with this i just like you've it well okay i mean some of these things like perfect keto like i don't have a day to day role in it anymore you know so i like c founded it but have completely stepped away one of the things that at kettle and fire that i think i'm proud of that we've done really well is like we a phenomenal team and so to that to that extent i get to work on stuff that only i can do uniquely well like writing long fifteen page posts about how beef is actually like not bad for the environment and shit like this that i'm kinda interested in but a lot of the day day is handled by like the team that we've built over the last you know five five plus years so i really like am control of my time in general which just quite partner with a guy like anthony or whoever you're partnering with and you aren't doing how many of these things do have right now where you have your hands in roughly right now it's like five probably okay and so but there's one that's your day job right yeah okay so for the other four when you make these structures with people so a guy like anthony or it doesn't have to be him but that representative that represents him are you taking a draw from that business at all or are you just only gonna pay yourself if it sells yeah so at this point i'm pretty focused on like creating equity value and so you know for example like a company at inc incubator shirley wines it's like a non alcoholic wine company we launched earlier this year i recruited i like basically had the idea tested it validated it line up supply chain hired in the operator not the operator in and ceo he's taken a salary and like i probably won't get a dollar out of that business for until we eventually sell that business or whatever happens with it like i put in a bunch of my own money to capitalize it and get it up and running but i'm just like i'm not gonna suck money out of that thing until you know until we have a good outcome so then really the only thing you over the thing not the only i mean the thing you're bringing the table is you are bringing a little bit of cash and also you're bringing some expertise in your guide yeah totally but but it also like inc the whole idea that in that one yeah yeah i mean i think it's basically like trying to create a a compelling opportunity for someone where you know someone can go instead of going if someone to be found our ceo today their options are like jump take no salary for twelve to eighteen months hope they can figure out an idea and raise money and do all that kind of stuff or like build a side hustle which is again like a totally different skill set that we're kinda talking about and so with this one specifically like i inc the idea had everything lined up validated that it was big brought investors and basically it was like hey man if you wanna be a founder and ceo you can just walk into this role you take zero healthcare zero salary risk and you're you're good like you're your founder you have a ton of upside you're this operating ceo we've have investors lined up a big opportunity like it it sort of works for both parties you know when you are you do you regret or are you thankful that you raised money for kettle fire oh definitely thankful i mean really with yeah for sure i mean with with kettle and fire in particular like the business had grown to a really meaningful amount and i still had like most of my net worth wrapped up in that and so i think getting some secondary was like personally really meaningful and it also meant that like i felt more okay pushing for a bigger outcome it also meant like i think i will probably raise for most things that i do going forward or invest my own money just because the caliber of the team that we were able to hire around us like what we were doing on a shoe string budget versus what we could do after was just night and day like we we've have an amazing team but amazing people are expensive and so it's definitely like made my life a hundred times easier and more enjoyable getting to spend other people's money to increase the value of my equity by hiring amazing people it's like that seems like a no brainer to me in a lot of ways yeah i when you explain that way it does but if i was one of your investors and and you're doing all this other stuff i would be like what the fuck dude only do this thing i just gave you money yeah yeah i mean look it's it's something that i to work through with our investors for sure was very upfront with it with them about it and was like look this is my main focus you know with which was very true and it it was definitely something to manage around i also think though that like it's one of those things where as long as the business is going well no one's gonna complain you know what i mean but certainly if things went sideways then it's then it's like okay this is a an easy area to point thing it's like elon can run tesla spacex and everyone's like yeah wow he's amazing and those business are amazing and and jack does the same thing with twitter and square and if twitter misses its earnings it's like off with his head how dare he you know yeah he's a part time ceo with the hell were we thinking and and so it's you know people are pretty they do what's called resulting pretty hard in in that case and you also did i like a pretty fun experiment i don't know if this was a side hustle or what would you call this where me and sam were both guinea pigs in your your continuous glucose monitoring trial so you basically tweeted out yeah i was setting like i was setting him like shirtless picks of myself like every week yeah it typically that would thought a little piece that was not even like recommend you yeah there was like a pissed spot in one of my picks pissed spot what is that it when your boxes like you know when you go pee like leak little on your boxer yeah so sam sent me like a just him and his boxer photo and they're just a little pea spot to show his body failure right and so you were doing this thing where you were like hey i need like twenty people or i don't know how many maybe is forty people that you ended up using fifty people when you were like hey we're gonna do with this experiment and what you did was you sent us all a levels glucose monitor and then continues glucose monitor that we just you know puncture into our arm basically now okay that's measuring and then you put us all in like whatsapp group and you're like hey here's the idea and it was like financial incentive i think it was like yeah you would pay us out every day that i we stayed in range and if we missed it like you kept our money or something like that what what was that experiment and what'd you learn out of it man it was awesome like that that experiment was kinda like many things in my life i just had the idea tweeted it immediately and got such a strong response from people we had like a weight yeah totally where i was like okay now i gotta i figure this out you know sam was texting me every day being like this is sweet like i'm i'm gonna get all my fucking money back like you're very it and i loved it i was into it yeah i was doing awesome but yeah so learned a ton man i mean one of the craziest things i think was just how well that incentive of like twenty five dollars a day really worked for people to keep them keep them honest like you go through you know pay nine hundred fifty bucks for thirty days every day that you stay under a barrier like give you twenty five bucks back and just that tiny little behavior like incentive where that brownie or whatever is not four dollars but it's twenty nine dollars like that i think that little incentive goes a really long way and it's somewhat competitive and all this and so we have had with literally no marketing you know we've we've filled up fifty person cohorts every month since launching that in february always you know live yeah yeah people can still sign up it's wearable challenge dot com we've had one person go through it at seven times they've lost about fifty pounds it's like unbelievable who to see the results of this who's who's running that yeah so one of the guys in the first cohort aaron got so excited about the idea i was like hey do you wanna run with this and so he he's been running it that's amazing and is that a business to you or what is that not really i mean we're we're kinda thinking about like how to make it a business but but it's it's actually a perfect example of a side hustle like i will probably make you know somewhere between twenty and thirty grand this year from doing right yeah when i maybe more of sam joins and blows a bunch of his glucose levels when when i saw that i was like hey this is fun and it's kinda like on brand for you because of the stuff you you talk about your businesses but then i was also like oh this a great business because everybody wants the outcome everybody wants to eat right lose weight and the biggest hack is not knowledge but accountability and i like that you were coming at it from a accountability point of view and i actually think like you know the the company levels could do something like this or the there's gonna be a company that does this right the whatever weight watchers is as a business model like i haven't studied it i'm assuming you have given what you do and what this business is but could this not be like weight watchers two point o i think it could be i mean it just it would need someone to like run at it at really full time but i do think that there's something here i mean there's a couple companies like stick and like one other that i'm forgetting where you can sort of like bet money on on different outcomes and you know i think that that sort of works i actually think the really powerful part of this is like it's a cohort it's a challenge for a set period of time and you lose money only for that set period right and and so like i would love to expand this and we're sort of have some ideas in the in the hopper about like what expanding it might look like but it's definitely not my like full time thing at all have you heard of stick sean that's actually an interesting company to buy i haven't been there in years but when i used to go there it was even when i went there like years ago it was considered like old so it's stick it's spelled stick but i think there's two k's at the end right yep and it's like a physical twice no it's a web stick dot com but two k's at the end and is the website still all old and jan looking yeah okay so it was like old back then when or in two thousand thirteen or fourteen when i used to use it and what you do is you enlist a friend to be the referee and then you create i believe an anti charity where you select something that you hate and then you upload money to it and then if you fail at your challenge your friend clicks a button and it automatically goes to that place that you hate and i i think you can you there's a varieties of of the talked about this i think in four hour workweek weekend and i think it got possibly in that yeah yeah it it do do you think this company makes money justin i would imagine so i don't know how much but that could it would it could be an interesting thing to buy i mean it's actually not that hard to but like they already get traffic it could be it would be an interesting this would be an interesting thing to buy and revamp and make a little bit better because i think they get a lot of traffic when i when we owned tout do there was this one guy an author okay i think he wrote a book getting things done g g yeah yeah allen and yeah and he mentioned tu do this app that me and ramon bought and most of our customers came to us because they read about hud do like it just mentioned them in like a sentence or something in the book and that's where most of the customers came from and just because tim ferris mentioned stick i bet that's where the the vast majority of their customers come from for sure yeah that's funny i there was this thing called gym packed too i don't know if you guys have have have you seen that it i don't know if it made it it was like it came out five years ago or something like that but it was you would basically pledged that you're gonna go to the gym with some numb some frequency and other people would too and it basically i think what they were doing was like in your case you're the house you're like the bank it's like i give you the money and then you pay me back and in this case it was like it would match you with somebody else and if you ever didn't do your thing your money would go to that person if they did it and you didn't go your money would go to them and if you both went your your money would be safe and until you're like making a pack that you would go to the gym for you know some amount of frequency but i do think there is something to this like kind of financial incentive accountability you know betting betting on yourself betting on your habit model i think it's pretty cool yeah i'd i totally agree i mean we're we're actually looking now at like could you apply this to run little you know health boot camps in like la or austin or something like that where you have thirty people fifty people opt in we'll handle your meals we'll you know we'll give you levels like we'll do all this sort of stuff and a more like premium offering but where it's like hey you're almost guaranteed to lose weight or get in better shape at the end of this month that would for sure work that's a little bit better than my weight loss idea which is called kid nap where you just go and you take a person and you bring them to the desert in like vegas and you just with at the end yeah can all the kid kick that messed up or we're we'll call hostage and we just bring you to like a farm and we just like it's like look you only fifteen hundred calories a do it everyone all day but like this is it i love that can i have some refund rates would be high on that well you know it'll be guaranteed success so i wanna get to some of these ideas but i first wanna ask you about duck dug go so your friends with that guy gave right the guy who started or owns it and are you bullish on that business because you're one of the few people i know that has insight onto it and i'm i look at their traffic monthly like because they give out these incentive updates that does that is that business like a like kinda like an under the radar thing do you think this is gonna take over the world because that's kinda how i feel yeah i mean i i think it's it's crushing like i think that you always see like there's always like a counter point to some massive trend or massive amount of success like you have like amazon taking over the world but then you have shopify which is crushing it and i think that duck dot is like the counter point to to like google and you know privacy eroding across the board all this sort of stuff like i do think there's an opportunity to be a big tech company but with private like privacy is a core value rather than you know selling ads to everyone and so i think duck really has that the opportunity to like be that company and have a lot of tailwind that are working in their favor at this point it it's also crazy like gabe he's been working on that company for like twelve years five of those years yeah than twelve i feel like it might be actually but like for a large chunk of that time he was just a solo founder building a search engine to compete with google it's like wow so they they do north of a hundred million in revenue i believe yeah i i believe do you mean how like i don't know if don't know if you knew him during those early years but like did you know him at the beginning or no not not the very very beginning but i knew him when it was like him and one other person working on du and so i'm guessing at that point it wasn't it wasn't a case where tim and one other the person in man it's crushing it's him and one other the person and it's sort of crawling forward yeah what were those like what were your conversations like what was the outlook i mean i find it fascinating when people work on these businesses that don't take off right away and they stick with it and then they to either like the world just changes or they figure something out or just compound low slowly but then all of a sudden it starts to take off like what was that like they're in the flat part and then what do you think caused it to grow yeah i think that he was he was just getting like small bits of positive feedback from communities like hacker news community was like duck is amazing for like stack overflow searches or you know x y and z very specific niche sorts of searches and then as you got good feedback from those groups it's like okay let's invest in product to make this a little better a little better and i think that after you know let's call it twelve fourteen years that he's been working on this the product has gotten a lot better but also the like sort of trend line of where big tech is going has it's just gotten like way more way more invasive and and way more like privacy is way more of a concern for people today especially as you're seeing a lot of the the censorship stuff and you know some of this that's that's happening in the big tech world right now i think that du dot is like one of the few companies that for over a decade now has been like privacy is one of our our like core things and they've built an incredibly complex product to compete with google that is just not easy to spin up overnight you know it's not a side hustle it's not like the type of thing you i can build with a couple hours a week over you know weekend can we talk about can we go through some of these ideas you wanna start with airbnb camping because i you you were text me about this i and i wanna learn about it i just looked at a house the other day by the way down the street from my house to buy for airbnb i'll have to send you the numbers i don't know if it it seems like a lot of work for now a lot of output we'll see yeah i i think that's probably true for a lot of airbnb right now i think the thing that is compelling to me is like we talked earlier about new platform stuff like hip camp and some of these other like camping platforms are exploding and again i think if you could like leverage capital build up the supply side and provide like you know water toiletries like all all the basics in locations that people actually wanna camp at you could build a pretty material business and it again it like may not be a ten billion dollar business but i think would be a really solid side hustle and cash flow asset and it would would require a lot less a lot less like management and work than airbnb because at the end of the day fucking camping like sorry you know it's not like the the stove burner doesn't work or the ac is off it's like a pot of your plop the on the experience i provided for you we're where nothing worked and you had to fend for yourself that's what we want maybe maybe i can host hostage over did you when you when you were doing this what numbers were you battling out yeah so i was mainly modeling it from on like a no basis which is net operating income which is like a term that's used a lot in real estate but basically i think that you could get like thirty to forty percent cash rent cash returns by following the strategy that sounds like the greatest thing ever why why you done it because i am getting high returns from my time elsewhere you know so course will do this i love to find someone to run if somebody who's listening to this is like oh i'm the perfect guy for i i i i love camping i know i have camper i have a camper myself i'm in an area that's like a high demand thing for for hip camp or auto camp or whatever yeah great you be the operator we'll put up the cash we'll buy the rv for you and you wrote the thing and let's split it so email me sean at sean p dot com and then i'll i'll loop in these guys and we will we will fund your we'll will fund a a small rental business of of campers if anybody's in the location that does this because that's a great great you're absolutely right they're basically tons of demand and there's supply constrained and so if you just build out more supply you're gonna get bookings and you're gonna get great returns off so yeah exactly and and it's one of those things that's like that can scale really nicely these platforms are here to stay like there's a lot of ventured dollars going into making these more of a thing i think that you could crush it on these platforms is it something i wanna do full time at this point my career no but do i think someone younger who like cares about camping more than i do could really do well here like absolutely okay great that's great idea what else you got alcohol baby let's talk about that yeah so near dear to my heart as a as a as a as a non alcoholic beer drinker yeah so you know a couple earlier this year launched the company that i talked about shirley high shared dot com s u r e l y but we're we're basically like we saw so much interest going into the non a space bud light bought three spots of the super bowl one was the seltzer spot the other was for bud light the other was for bud zero which is like the non out thing is so interesting and like there's so much attention going towards it and we saw like a ton of really good non out beers with some really good like non out spirits options and nothing in the wine category and so we decided to build the first clean label really high quality non alcoholic wine brand and wine company hired like real wine making talent and the like and we launched earlier this year and it's going going super well so i how much you by the way i wanna brag i've been talking about this shit for like four years now have a nice sean i don't know if that's a brag or really it's a it's a knock on you you had the inside he took the action he i don't translate i don't that's true that that's true i mean yeah i'm just talking shit but but you and so i get like a i get like a like a just like a like a add boy yeah yeah i deserve an out of voice for that for that for sure i think you were gonna kinda ask him something like how much did you put in to start this basically how much of your own money did you did you have to seed into making venture like this happen yep so i put in a close to a hundred k to make this happen and some portion of that was a loan that that i got out just as like revenue started to come but yeah it's about a hundred days been up no not a lot that's great no yeah it's not a crazy that's a weekend for sam thank you i feel i feel like i feel like like it okay so you're telling me you could start this with a hundred grand and how many hours a week ago are you working on this i to get it spun up i mean it was much more like hiring the right contractors and people so was five ten maybe and okay i feel like there's a world where this like let let's be conservative i feel like there's a like this is very clearly a ten million dollar a year thing that makes two million in profit right like like it it could definitely be way bigger but i feel like that's a relatively like i'd be disappointed forward hit that mark right that's kinda what you're saying yeah you that would expectations at least yeah so so right like and let's give be let's give it six years to do that let's go let's grow slow i feel like that's like a it's pretty surefire away you're gonna get that would you you agree yeah i certainly yeah and so so like that was the case right a d brand like that can sell for like 1x x revenue let's say so you could turn a hundred k investment and let's call it even twenty hours a week for for a year to spin it up to you you're two you turned a hundred k into basically you know ten million bucks worth of of of total equity value in turn in in terms of the company in that case i don't even think it would take like sixty i think that's two two your yeah being in like ultra i would agree but yeah i mean that's a basic thing where are the other opportunities in the space that you when you were researching yeah i mean i there's ton right like i think that we're at this generational shift where people you know ten years ago everyone was like let's go out maybe this is just me getting older i don't know but all of my friends were like let's go out to the bars and get really drunk now all my friends are like let's have one glass of wine and then like have a great long dinner and or try you know we're not drink at all and instead of you don't young people i don't think drink yeah it it's it's becoming much more common shockingly that's what i'm saying like the gen z is like like it's not as common like when the second i could drive because have you heard terms gen z analysis that he does his trends analysis on gen he's like they don't have sex they don't drinking and they're depressed but they're really cool looking or what do see what do he call them yeah they're really cool they got they got nice teeth they always wear vans and they like they always have like proper video color do they like what do i say of like red i don't know or millennials have like a really sweeping general for that yeah it's like the truth use tiktok like y'all have like sick ass haircuts it's true they all got like amazing i've just got z cut right out he's he's looking at he's looking at gen they're the young people i'm saying they they don't they don't have they don't have a lot of sex not nearly as much as before and they just even with all that ethan and hair they can't they're out in sex what's going on dude i don't know it's testosterone is down fifty percent over the last like forty years that's right yeah maybe that's it it's like that's is some there's something going on here and they also don't like alcohol like it's it's a health thing or i i don't know what it is they don't drink yeah i mean i i honestly think one of the reasons i'm bullish on the non out space is like we are getting to the point where they're just better drugs like if people wanna you know alter their state of consciousness i'm seeing a lot more friends that are like opting into cannabis or ketamine or some of you know psychedelics or some of these other things that don't give you the hangover don't give you the thirty extra pounds over a year of heavy drinking like i i just think people are opting for for different sorts of compounds different high give them the experience they want exactly i tried that recess drink you guys tried that the yeah doesn't kinda like carbonated drink great branding amazing branding i would say drink taste like shit and didn't do anything so i was like well i'm out on that one but yeah i love the idea i kinda wish it if we just if they just put lac crow in that can i'd feel amazing i'd be like yeah this is the best this is the future but instead you know they try their own thing what are some businesses that you're like you mentioned testosterone we've invested this testosterone replacement company because we like that same which one it's called peak or they're just rebranding to home but basically it's at home direct consumer you know testing for your tea levels and then when you get tested and it's if it's low you're they there's like a telemedicine doctor who who'll will be like hey by the way if you want to go up you know like there are some solutions that we can offer you basically they have their own you've not heard of that justin i've heard of t i didn't i didn't heard of like peak or it's basically when z t i'm right than it to throw six letters yeah you don't believe in it it's real yeah yeah maybe that's not a a well said thing but i tend to think that some of these things it's like you know your testosterone levels are low it's like okay the reason that they're low is some inputs from your environment are not healthy and so rather than trying to fix the symptom like you try and fix the environment but what of the biggest you know you can change to to boost testosterone from your from your opinion i i i think diet sleep in like inflammation and then also trying to cut out like endo dis disrupting hormones which are i think like a horrifying thing that not a lot of people are talking about what is talk about it so different plastics compounds like you've heard of like bp free and only these sorts of things the whole class of something called ph such is p t p t h l a t e s that that effectively have like a really strong negative impact on one's testosterone one's like endo ukraine and hormonal systems and they're that are in like everything they're basically avoiding likes order from something else yeah a lot of plastics yeah so these are like some synthetic materials that are just in like water plastics food packaging creams that you use like they're they're in they're ever what's something you do lifestyle wise that i'd be like dude why are you doing that like i went to my friend's house one time and he instead of using toothpaste he was like he dipped his toothbrush in like this powder and started of brushing his teeth i was like hey man what the fuck is that because he's always like three steps ahead in health and like products and so and he at first i used to judge him and i'm like oh am i killing myself by using toothpaste should i be using this powder shit and mike you know yeah what what are those what what would yours be can i guess justin can i do i guess do you use a microwave no not i didn't think okay other than like use yeah but like you go out of your way to not use a microwave right yeah yeah yeah okay do you you definitely only have glass tu wear correct yeah for sure what else is there do you i i've got a few more i i i've got a few more like a pig you but you tell me i got this like nineteen step home water filtration thing installed in my house that's like the metal one it's like twenty five feet tall and in this outside it's insane like outdoors the plumbers yeah yeah they they they're at every step so there's one other sink there's one outside that like filtered all the home water the guys came into install and they're like we have never seen anyone install something like this but yeah i i have that set up that i just recently got the top wear stuff pretty diet cautious in general are you super ripped i can't see of your your neck up here are you like okay no he's lean yeah you're lean you're like ten percent body fat i'll send you a pea spot photo yeah i i i need a pee well i've seen you without a shirt like you're not like like huge but you're like you look like a like a just like a shock play who's more fit you're were justin it depends what we're talking about who is do you aspire more for your body or for his body go i would i right now i prefer to be leaner and skin so i'm trying to lose fat and look a little bit more like his body alright great alright so you have the insane water filtration system and what is that by the way what what's the name of it it is called the radiant life i think but there's another one john you saw the people i do i have was saw do you like definitely saw my back here is it infrared or is it us hot it's it's the yeah it's like the the hot one and like red lights on your shows or something in the morning what you what you do anything with any kind of light uv anything no i try to get outside i mean it this is one of those things that i think is like there's some people that i think over optimize where they're like oh i need more light exposure so i'm gonna stay inside and like shine red light on myself and i'm like just it's you do do you only use zero drop shoes no what is that i did for a while i just didn't really what is a zero crab shoe so basically shoes with no heel yeah most shoes have some type of what yeah but like the a lot of people believe that ruins your achilles and hurts your calves and a bunch of ruins your posture do you do you only eat meat from salt and time i try to when again it's the best meat in austin for sure where do you eat your meat from so i'd now like eat most of my meters is from salt time poor stuff that i've hunted or a friend is hunted love this is all okay great did we miss any other ones any other good like sort of self i don't know what do even call these well look i i think what we're teasing but there is truth in this like guys who are on the cutting edge and yeah things that we joke and laugh at i believe that's gonna be normal you know like totally i got i remember like years ago i i got into this hobby about raw denim which is like it at the time it was like super nerdy and everyone made fun of me and it it didn't get entirely mainstream but a little bit mainstream it it got quite popular and that and that was that's kinda like what we're talking about here so like i remember years ago people were talking about ayahuasca and i was like what the fuck is that that and now like i know so many people that are doing this stuff so totally like oh and dan said you use non stick pants you definitely you don't use non stick pants for sure i can tell that yeah i i use a ceramic set or cast iron yeah yeah that that that's an easy one but anyway go ahead what what was the answer were you gonna are there any other things that we can learn from how you live yeah i mean i i think that like cutting out things that are causes of inflammation or or the obvious ones it's like don't microwave stuff in plastic try and like buy stuff that is over not overly processed and packaged and i think actually like avoiding vegetable oils is a tremendous tremendous thing that like you said about raw denim or ayahuasca you know five years from now ten years from now a lot of people are gonna be way more conscious about vegetable oils and the damage that bay specifically like a compound called lin lake acid in there that the damage that does to like your inflammatory use instead olive or peanut but what yeah i mean hopefully olive oil avocado oil animal fats large ghee butter stuff like that coconut oil you wanna talk about you wanna talk about one or two more of these sean or what yeah let's do let's see you pick you pick the topic let's do one more topic oh i know i gonna to ask you really quick all these things that you're doing just like no microwave all this stuff do you actually feel a difference or is it is it like all long term or is there any short term pleasure that i can get out of these right do you feel different yeah so i the way that i think about this is like from a baseline standpoint you know if you if you were pretty high baseline like imagine you're super strong it it's gonna be really hard for you to notice if you're a body builder if you're putting on like one percent you know two pounds of muscle or something if you already or if you're already like buying two twenty five so i think that i have a pretty high like health baseline and so a lot of these things are more preventative and not like oh my god i feel amazing you know whereas i felt like shit the other day but for i think the average person like if your baseline is relatively low you wanna lose like or average you wanna lose weight you're not sleeping well you know your stress hormones are all over the place a lot of these interventions like you'll feel a material difference after like twenty or thirty days i think there's a world to build like a wire cutter version of this so for example like you're saying a lot of stuff and my friend my best friend jack is into all this stuff and and the and whom i say at his house and i visit them and so that's how i like i see how he lives and jack's really honest and i'll say he takes all these supplements i go do any of these do anything and he goes no i like i don't feel any different and like a guy like you i imagine you actually care about longevity and also you just like to tinker and you like try gadgets you know i like trying to gadgets as well i just wanna like see the latest experience that it's fun to experiment i would love but but the issue is is that someone like you like or not you but peep some of the poke in your world like they can get a little woo and i'm like i don't know if they're like talking about fucking crystals or if this is actually gonna make a difference in my life it's really hard to know like it like this actually truly is meaningful i went and i went to peter peter ate blog about this as well to learn about fitness and he talks about so much stuff about fitness and diet and i'm like just give me the if you just do this life will be a little bit better and you're eighty percent there yeah i i think there's a big opportunity for that i i think that one of the problems is like if you're an influencer you're gonna get way more attention and interest from people when you talk about butt hole sunny then you are about like eat a healthy diet you what i mean look yeah totally like i think that's the all sunny yeah you've seen yeah or par amazing what's that mean same thing you never seen this article same it will eyed super viral basically send you a oh what bunch of we're going at like they're tan but then they raise their legs above their heads so that the sun goes directly into their butt and they're like oh you know never felt better you know if fight to sun's energy right in here fourth eye do we wanna go over one more thing or two more thing do you wanna do what's your call well we can't end butt hole somebody there i guess guess that will probably leave a bad so i've got interesting you you have something interesting and i wanna so i've got a friend named nick you you know nick gray and nick he he jokes about it but he's been serious he matches with girls on tinder or whatever app he uses and he calls them for a pre screening for a day he's like let's just talk to each other because he's nick's he just wants to get down a business like or do we wanna date or not and he calls them and one of the questions he asked sean right away is what's your credit history or like do you have right and odd here justin has he goes i think i can create a dating app that pays off your credit card history but but used to be clear it's not your credit rating he's talking about not like i only wanna rich credit or people it's more like if i know what you're want to be rich at but or whatever is what you're saying is i wanna look at your purchase history basically the stuff you buy if you shop at whole foods if you go to the gym if you don't with whatever you gonna you ring up a bill that'll tell us how compatible we are that was your idea yeah exactly and are you dating right now are you single i am reasonably engaged christ engaged the class and if you matched you and your fiance bills up four you got engaged would would you've been a good match great fit great fit yeah for sure that's i think that like where you spend your resources tells a lot about someone that a hinge profile doesn't and so i suspect if like you were to say hey we are matching the two of you up because you spend an absurd amount of your income atlas like weird butcher shop in austin or at whole foods like we're probably gonna get along you know or at least have a higher odds of doing that from a lifestyle compatibility standpoint then than hinge us you know sam what do you think alright let's do yeah i mean i mean i i think no this report i think this is one of those things that people i think we're gonna that one know but i enjoy that you said it yeah like i think my opinion is like when it comes to dating you really just like you wanna optimize for getting laid quickly i think like regardless if that's what people admit or not but like they just wanna get to like date one so they can get in bed for step two and i think that really people like they say they like so when we had a roommate matching app i don't know if you could actually vouch if you saw this on your end people said they wanted this they wanted that they wanted this and then they would meet someone and they're like math fuck it like i'll just do it right like so i think the same with dating you say you wanna do this wanna do that but then if i show you like a person who you just think is attractive even though you had all these rules you're gonna say alright whatever let's just do it yeah yeah no i think that's probably true i think this probably would be better as a like match making service than a broad based dating app right and and then well let's let's wrap up with the one that we've actually talked about before about this automation officer yeah let's do it basically i think with the rise of no code tools virtual assistance all this sort of stuff like think the average company and we we do this at at my company could just be thirty percent more productive like we we have basically one virtual assistant hire for every two people that we have that are on the team and we give them like a training that's like here's how to use virtual assistants get all of the repetitive stuff off your plate and i just wish i could hire someone to do that as a service where like he or she sits in product meetings or marketing or logistics team shit and it's just like we're gonna automate these five pieces and just continually does that across the company where did you learn that from who that's so so interesting to give vas to every everyday people yeah i i just started doing it when we started the company i think that's pretty amazing right it's right right how did you learn the how to how to manage a va what you can use them for what you can't where did you learn that part obviously star like what was the spark yeah i when i when i left when i left like the company i was working with terry app we got acquired and then i was kinda like starting to do my own stuff on the side and was like okay i wanna try and scale myself to do more stuff on the side so like originally hired vas to help with responding to airbnb request and then viewed to me request and then like slowly got them more integrated into my life i love it and did you take a course or something like where did you this training that you have for for your employees is that modeled up something or what no we we basically like we have some internal documents that myself and other people on the team have written up around how to leverage virtual assistance and we just do that you should publish this yeah i feel like that's i think like you're kinda like this you're not dismissing this but you're kinda like brushing over this i feel like that's actually one of the more interesting things that i've learned today i think that's actually pretty amazing i've had a lot of people asking me for this and i actually suck it using vas and don't really use them but i know i should and could do more and this is one of if i i i kind of like ping up the audience i was like alright if i could teach you anything that you think like what do you think i could teach you that i know that that you wanna know and surprisingly this was like number five on that list and so i plan to eventually a learn it myself and better so that i can like offer this others but i was very surprised to see that on the top list of things people wanted to learn that they felt like they was just curious about and they felt that there was value there but they didn't know how to unlock it that's interesting yeah i mean maybe this is something that i should publish at some point and i don't know how much do what what what how much budget do you allocate is it like two grand a month per two people or what we yeah we probably about that like call it like ten ish grand across like the whole company so you what do you guys have you have twenty people we have thirty three dude that's pretty sick how you've kept it like relatively small for i i yeah i have no intel i would imagine your revenue is in the sixty million range if i had to guess and that's pretty a lean mean team for how how much value that is definitely and i think the va piece is a big part of it like we just have a very efficient team that's pretty focused on getting stuff done that they uniquely can do and the v the va are super helpful with the rest well dude this is sick man i i can't see sean's face i can't where you have my camera overheat this is a a recurring problem i moved it all i moved my whole setup up inside for this but then i also got two babies inside so i thought alright do i wanna risk babies crying or my camera overheat guaranteed camera overheat and i i chose the camera just justin do you wanna promote yourself where where do you want where do you want people to go to i i a lot of people are gonna listen to this so what your dot com your twitter where where are you gonna what are gonna a pin yeah so probably my twitter i'm at j w mayor's or you know my website justin myers dot com i have a monthly newsletter that i send out where i talk about various things i think about health business and whatever else is kinda on my mind that seems like people like i think sam like it too right yeah i'm i'm looking at your stuff now i'm a subscriber i get your it's not a sub stack it's just a blog right yeah but i have a monthly newsletter that is on subs stack but not yeah that's right i i get your emails in my thing or in my email and i i and i messaged you about it i'm like oh yeah i just saw your airbnb thing i'm because i actually wanna do i think that's sick i i think that'd be a great way to finance like a a pretty large bit of land i think that's fun i went go i went shooting it i went to this place out in texas where you shoot guns and then afterwards you go and ride to atv and it was like i was in heaven i was like this is just the most fun i could possibly have i have to go and buy a place so i could do this all the time it's awesome what do you guys say sean i was gonna say justin i gotta give the the compliment i'll give your blog is that your your content is so good it made me question i was like is this guy really like a good entrepreneur or is this like because like usually like there's some people who are truly great at putting out content and truly great at do it actually like walking the walk and doing the doing the business side have actually done it themselves so not just like studying others and creating content but often what you'll find is that people are good at one of the i know a bunch of amazing business people who don't want to or suck at creating content and i know some great content people that i'm like once i meet them i'm like oh you've this is what this is your business you've never done a business outside of this content business and so then when i found out that you were good at i was okay you you know props to you for both but that's how good the content was that it made me it made me do the research and say is this is this kinda legit or what i appreciate that i'm definitely not good at like the content business side of things or posting frequently but i i i like you putting it out i'm wanna do this for your yeah you've been doing it for years i'm looking at your site now i'm reading your two thousand twenty review i i just clicked off central athlete because you talked about central athlete i mean it seems like you've been doing this for years so i mean that's consistent definitely i i like it but in small doses not as a full time thing alright great we should happy about dude thanks for coming on this is fun yeah you're like a perfect fit for like the type of audience that we have they're gonna love i think the content that you or the ideas and stuff you shared it so that was great thank you thanks for having me on guys it was fun yeah i feel like i could rule world i know i could be what i want to from at all in and like a day's off on a travel never looking back